Okay so they shot the wrong dude...

[J-girl]

now I am not sure how I feel about this whole shit. All I can imagine is a bunch of British wankers chasing the wrong dude down the tube. All this happeneing in a very multi cultural city where "looking mid eastern" could mean anything...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4714691.stm

[lawya girl]

Is the link supposed to be related to the story? ;)

[J-girl]

Bastard! I changed it haha!

[LakeJay]

That is a pretty sad situation...for everyone involved. I'm still unsure as to what prompted police to shoot him. Was it that he was running? I am kind of torn with this situation. I understand what Blair is saying about the police working under difficult circumstances but it is very hard to justify the killing of an innocent man. I can't imagine what the family is going through.

[J-girl]

Yeah he started to run. Who knows he could be an illegal immigrant or he was carrying cocaine on him.

Also he was wearing a coat in the middle of the summer. Come to think of it I was in England at this time of the year and I was freezing my butt off too cuz the weather is so lame.

[lawya girl]

And he also came out of a house they had been staking out. I believe it was a really heavy coat too - not something you would really see in the summer - even in England.

[meatwad]

He was wearing a padded coat in the summer, and when the police tried to talk to him he ran away into a subway. Since subways had been or attempted to be blown up six times in the past month, they tried to stop him. I'm sure the cops didn't want to give him a chance to blow up so they stopped him by any means necessary. Unfortunately he apparantly turned out to not be a terrorist.

[J-girl]

I think he had drugs on him or he was selling drugs. HE was probably oblivious to all the bombings happening.

[paiger81]

He was wearing a padded coat in the summer, and when the police tried to talk to him he ran away into a subway. Since subways had been or attempted to be blown up six times in the past month, they tried to stop him. I'm sure the cops didn't want to give him a chance to blow up so they stopped him by any means necessary. Unfortunately he apparantly turned out to not be a terrorist.

Yep, this is what my dad says. Basically, that's what you get for being a dumbass & running from cops.

Was he justifiably murdered by the cops?

I'm not saying it's right, but I do think it was justified.

[J-girl]

J-Girl,

Don't tell me you've changed your mind about racial profiling!

Meatwad,

Was he justifiably murdered by the cops?

OSS- Even in my past posts I did mention that the cops need to be educated first before they go around racial profiling. This morning on the subway I saw a bunch of Arab teenagers talking about Pamela Anderson's boobs, I doubt any of them wanted to blow anything up.

I dont think his murder was justified at all. It was an error of judgment.

[Jedi of Zen]

OSS- Even in my past posts I did mention that the cops need to be educated first before they go around racial profiling.

How must they be educated?

[LakeJay]

How must they be educated?

I was just thinking about this when J-Girl first posted. Unfortunately our police force has been underfire for racial profiling hence...

http://www.state.nj.us/oag/newsreleases05/pr20050628c.html

[CoastConfusion]

It WAS an error in judgement. I'm not excusing this man for running from the cops - particularly at this time in London....but a) he was fairly light skinned (which doesn't fit the "profile") b) he was in Britain legally; c) he was Roman Catholic. Obviously the police offiers chasing/shooting him couldn't know that...but it's pretty scary nonetheless. I don't have an answer to this problem, but a shoot-to-kill (as opposed to shoot to wound) policy for officers who don't normally carry weapons freaks me out.

[J-girl]

I have a LOT of respect for the Polica Force. Nothing but admiration. But I have noticed that a lot of guys these days become police officers cuz they dont want to go to college. They are extremely close minded (some of them), they need to be trained on the general ethos of the city they are living in.

They had a program in Vancouver, BC where they were trained on multiculturalism and different people from different cultures spoke and answered their questions.

[Benwa]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4713753.stm

Another link that highlights the victim a little more.

The whole incident is proof that terrorism apparently works. A few months ago no one would believe you if you said something like that happened in england of all places. They've been scared crazy. I imagine the bobbies who shot him feel awful.

I think they're taking it harder because stuff like that never happens in England. But in America it happens enough to where there isn't much shock value. Every once in a while you'll hear of a story of cops firing 80 shots at a guy who had his music too loud or he was holding a burrito and they thought it was a gun. We're used to our police having a high testosterone level and doing sketchy things. Its as american as smog. Maybe its cynical but I just feel like "Well, duh! Thats what police do." When you have a public thats gone stupid with fear and a select group of people as enforcers (who btw are also stupid with fear) and you give them guns, then some guys gonna get shot for "looking guilty".

[natbumpo]

I can not blame the cops at all and I really don't understand how anyone could. There were several bombings in train stations and more attempted in the recent days, they were staking out the house the guy came from, he was wearing a winter coat in summer and he ran. They way I see it, it is survival of the fittest at its best. There HAS to be a reason he ran, innocent people don't run, especially under those circumstances, especially into a tube station.

[Jedi of Zen]

Arggghhh! I hate it when this happens! LakeJay and J-girl, I wrote a fairly lengthy post for both of you (well mainly J-girl), but the system knocked me off because I took too long. Then I tried to go back and copy-and-paste what I had written, but I got one of those "Sorry, you took too long to post, so you suck" messages. Hate it when that happens.

LakeJay: Tried to follow your link, but nothing happened. But it's possible my browser is simply smoking crack on me again.

J-girl: (This is the short version of what I tried to post earlier - I'm too lazy to re-type everything :) - I think it is at least possible that no one would have had to die if Mr. De Menezes had simply stopped when police had verbally confronted him. I agree that many cops are basically dumb brutes - God knows I've had my own share of bad experiences with cops, esp here in the south, where every other cop is the fat, ignorant, good - ol - boy type. But I would think that in order to work as a police officer, 1. you can't exactly be a meek dormouse, and 2. a college degree may or may not be necessary. Another thought - do you believe that British cops would necessarily fit that same stereotype?

[Jedi of Zen]

I can not blame the cops at all and I really don't understand how anyone could. There were several bombings in train stations and more attempted in the recent days, they were staking out the house the guy came from, he was wearing a winter coat in summer and he ran. They way I see it, it is survival of the fittest at its best. There HAS to be a reason he ran, innocent people don't run, especially under those circumstances, especially into a tube station.

Uh, yes. Thank you. I'm with you on this one, natbumpo!

[J-girl]

I agree the guy was STUPID STUPID STUPID to run and that too into the tube. I think his time was up and he chose to wore the wrong coat on the wrong day (or right coat on the right day however you want to look at it).

I am not sure about the cops in England. But you giving guns to guys who are soo used to chasing down criminals on a street with a stick!

Yeah college education is a little pushing it but it doesnt seem like the police training makes for well rounded individuals.

ETA: I have a feeling he ran cuz he was carrying a stash of weed.

[Benwa]

Maybe he was an avid jogger.

[CoastConfusion]

I'll at least give the British gov't some credit. I don't think the gov't in the US would admit to killing an innocent man like that, in the wake of terrorist bombings.