For NYC people--at what point do you give up and go home?

[jrwilheim]

I'm six weeks away from exhausting my unemployment. Beyond that, I have $14K in a savings account, about half of which I borrowed from a relative for non-unemployment things (buying some furniture and moving into a different apt. next year). I have $4K sitting in a mutual fund, earmarked for a down payment on a house, and about $4K in various IRAs. I could probably make all of this money last a year if I had to, but I don't know if I can stand to see all this money just drain away.

At what point would you, faced with seemingly never-ending unemployment, leave this d****d city and go home? At what point does it no longer make sense to stay, for the sake of having an independent existence, when all you seem able to find are crappy, $10-an-hour data entry temp assignments?

[wordsmith]

At the point at which I could find a job I'm qualified for someplace where $14K (or even $7K) in a savings account, $4K in a mutual fund, and $4K in various IRAs is actually relatively decent money.

I guarantee you that NYC is not the only place on earth you can have an independent existence.

[SmilesSoSweet]

Why is the only other option moving back home? Like wordsmith said, there are plenty of other cities that you can still live in and have your independence.

it sounds like you have enough in savings to make a transition to move to another city/state. Why not research other places?

NYC isn't the only place to be.

[pisces2473]

Yeah, you mentioned Philly in another thread. I think you should explore things there--online, weekend trips, etc.

And NYC people are not the only ones who can help you out. I've left a "big city" too and went home.

[The X]

Though I have dreams of moving to NYC, that and LA are the only places in the US where "it's happening". That probably doesn't make any sense to anyone. Other places I'd like to live are like Paris and Toronto.

[SmilesSoSweet]

I really do think that NYC and LA are "overrated" since it's assumed that those places are where EVERYONE wants to be and the only places where EVERYTHING is happening.

I grew up Southern California, just outside of LA. And honestly, it's not all that it's cracked up to be. But that's my perspective since I grew up there. I just couldn't afford to live there much longer and I didn't want to just live in the same area I grew up in when I knew that there were plenty of other places to explore.

It did take me about a year to finally make a move out of state, but still, it was all worth it. Since the age of four, the furthest I've lived from my parents' house was 40 miles. It was enough distance for college, but it wasn't enough to "see everything" either.

At my last job, when one of my co-workers found out I was moving out of CA to AZ he was shocked. But then I told him that he did the same. He went moved from his home state of Indiana to move to CA and to "start over". I basically had to tell him that I was doing the same thing, except CA was where I grew up and I needed to "start over" some where else.

[J-girl]

JR- I am sure there are other cities with populations less than 8 mill that wont hinder your independence and the job market is not over saturated!

[WorkInProgress]

What sorts of jobs are you looking for, eventually. I feel very bad, but I really can't remember. I have a vague idea that you were looking for something related to financial stuff but I'm not sure if that's what you wanted to do, or what you thought would land you a job.

And yeah, if you feel like you've gone through all your luck, you might consider seeing what jobs are available (that you're qualified for) elsewhere.

[The X]

I believe you're right. Like I said these are merely fantasies I have, just that I have never lived in NYC, never lived that life, but I'd probably be miserable. Probably not uncommon among QLCers to wonder about other places to live eh?

[wordsmith]

Bear in mind that there is a lot of mythology about certain places, too. I've actually never been to NYC. But I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that it's probably not the case that everyday life is like an episode of Friends, Sex in the City, or what have you.

Really, this is a pretty big country to narrow it down to one or two places being the end all-be all.

[Kitty]

I don't know..I'd probably give myself like 4 months to find a real job.

But, I probably wouldn't move to NYC without a job already lined up.

[winneythepooh7]

At what point would you, faced with seemingly never-ending unemployment, leave this d****d city and go home? At what point does it no longer make sense to stay, for the sake of having an independent existence, when all you seem able to find are crappy, $10-an-hour data entry temp assignments?

I've noticed that a lot of people apply to work at my agency who are barely qualified for my $10/hour positions, yet, want to be starting out as a Program Director. I don't want to offend you, but I have noticed you talk up your Columbia degree a lot. It's cool that you went to any Ivy-league school and all that, but still, when it comes down to it, are you actually qualified for the positions you are applying for? I remember from a lot of your threads that you've jumped around a lot and held temporary positions. Unfortunately, that often is going to make you look like a liability for many companies. I've found that usually the most successful people who advance quickly are the ones who will start out at the bottom and don't turn their nose up at entry-level stuff, especially if they are out of work. In this day and age, it's not about where you got your degree from, sorry to say........

[winneythepooh7]

I don't know..I'd probably give myself like 4 months to find a real job.

But, I probably wouldn't move to NYC without a job already lined up.

I don't think I'd move anywhere without a job already lined up!

[asm198]

I never understood the draw and appeal of living in NYC or LA. Unless you're wanting to live there because of being in a certain job market that is only really available there, why put it up on such a pedestal?

Your only options aren't NYC and home, you know. There are lots of other cities in other parts of the country where you can be independent.

[WorkInProgress]

I don't think I'd move anywhere without a job already lined up!

Ditto that, if I could help it. I hated being unemployed and searching for work. Not something I want to do again.

[winneythepooh7]

I never understood the draw and appeal of living in NYC or LA. Unless you're wanting to live there because of being in a certain job market that is only really available there, why put it up on such a pedestal?

Your only options aren't NYC and home, you know. There are lots of other cities in other parts of the country where you can be independent.

Moving to NYC in 1999 (I now live in Long Island) was a saving grace for getting my career started. However, things were a lot different in just that little bit of time from then until now for finding employment. My field has changed a lot since that time, and the field has become extremely flooded. Another observation I have made is that the salaries have not gone up, despite the cost of living increasing. And I still get a bajillion resumes each day from people who think they are qualified for positions we are hiring for, but are not. I honestly don't think people read the job descriptions. It's pretty sad.

[Winter Storm]

I never understood the draw and appeal of living in NYC or LA. Unless you're wanting to live there because of being in a certain job market that is only really available there, why put it up on such a pedestal?

Your only options aren't NYC and home, you know. There are lots of other cities in other parts of the country where you can be independent.

Tell me about it. I have several friends right now who are thinking of moving to LA (they are musicians so it's understandable). But I don't see all the appeal either. Seems to me you'd be going from a big fish in a small pond to a tiny fish in a gigantic one.

Me, I've been considering Miami, San Diego, San Francisco, Chicago, DC, Atlanta, San Jose, maybe Phoenix.

[winneythepooh7]

There's something on CareerBuilder right now that says that NYC is ranked at the top of worst cities to move to in terms of finding a career right now. It also states that median salary is like $42K per year. It's really hard to live on that here. I make a few thou more than that and I am just scraping by really. At this rate it will take me 50 years to pay off my student loans......

[vivo]

Tell me about it. I have several friends right now who are thinking of moving to LA (they are musicians so it's understandable). But I don't see all the appeal either. Seems to me you'd be going from a big fish in a small pond to a tiny fish in a gigantic one.

Me, I've been considering Miami, San Diego, San Francisco, Chicago, DC, Atlanta, San Jose, maybe Phoenix.

awww, you'll be leaving balmur?

[The X]

Moving to NYC in 1999 (I now live in Long Island) was a saving grace for getting my career started. However, things were a lot different in just that little bit of time from then until now for finding employment. My field has changed a lot since that time, and the field has become extremely flooded. Another observation I have made is that the salaries have not gone up, despite the cost of living increasing. And I still get a bajillion resumes each day from people who think they are qualified for positions we are hiring for, but are not. I honestly don't think people read the job descriptions. It's pretty sad.
Can I say something winney, I've been reading your posts for a while here, and yeah it must be annoying to have people applying for jobs they're not qualified for, but it's kind of annoying reading you complain when people who don't have a job at all have it a lot worse. Don't be offended just saying you're preaching to the choir on this board.

[vivo]

Philly's of course getting better as are many cities in this country. It's one of the better downtowns. One of the problems with LA is I don't think it has a real downtown yet, but it's developing one. dc might be a good place but higher cost of living than phila. decent public transport (probably top 2 or 3 subway system in us) and I think the employment situation is good here because of the feds. not sure what your career field is though.

[Winter Storm]

awww, you'll be leaving balmur?

Got to....one day.

[winneythepooh7]

Can I say something winney, I've been reading your posts for a while here, and yeah it must be annoying to have people applying for jobs they're not qualified for, but it's kind of annoying reading you complain when people who don't have a job at all have it a lot worse. Don't be offended just saying you're preaching to the choir on this board.

Honestly, I don't feel sorry for people who don't do anything to better their situation when they are given advice on how to go about it. I have no patience for bitter people, and most of all, I have no sympathy for people who blame others for their problems. I've noticed a "trend" on this board as an older poster, that a lot of the newbies and even some of the people who've been here awhile expect everything to be handed to them on a silver platter, but don't want to work for it. That's not how life works. Grow up and stop whining. If you can't find a job in many situations, maybe it's not the employers, maybe it's you!! Carry on.......

[Kitty]

Unless you're wanting to live there because of being in a certain job market that is only really available there

I've honestly been thinking about moving to NYC..and that's pretty much the reason why. It's a valid, important reason.

[winneythepooh7]

I've honestly been thinking about moving to NYC..and that's pretty much the reason why. It's a valid, important reason.

How does your SO feel about that? With the right research, planning and connections, it could be a possible option.

[Kitty]

How does your SO feel about that? With the right research, planning and connections, it could be a possible option.

Well, we'd both move. It's really a good career move for both of us. I think we're at the point where if one of us gets a good job there, we'd move.

[CTGirl]

Are you applying for jobs nationwide or just in NYC? If you've been applying for jobs this whole time you've been unemployed, you may want to re-evaluate your strategy, cuz it seems like you're not really going at it the best way possible.

If I were you, I'd be applying for tons of jobs, across the country, jobs that I was qualified for, and that I could support myself on.

I'm with winney on this stuff, there's no use blaming the world for the problems you face, or letting yourself get down about them, you're responsible for your life - no one else is.

[winneythepooh7]

No one ever wants to listen to me, because I don't know what I'm talking about :rolleyes: but again, I just want to throw out there again the benefits of often starting out somewhere for less money, or in a "stepping stone" position. Often if you are good at what you do, you WILL advance pretty quickly. And often the networking opportunities, which provide opportunities for advancement are endless. For example, my most entry-level positions here may only pay $10.00 an hour, but those staff are around doctors, psychologists, speech therapists, occupational therapists, etc. all day. They are learning valuable skills that can help them advance to the next level in the human services field. They are MEETING others in the field who can help them advance. They learn about openings in other agencies that may be a better fit, higher pay and great opportunity. I'll use myself as an example. I started out at this company in a P/T direct-care position, while working in a hellish F/T position somewhere else. I talked to my supervisor at the time about the time I was having elsewhere and they CREATED a F/T supervisory position for me here. Then, he left, and I got to be the Program Manager here. NOW, my boss is talking about letting me start a new program closer to where I live, in Long Island, which would be so much better for me down the road. Originally, I wanted to NOT take that P/T position, and originally, I didn't want to leave my last job because of feeling secure. I also started out at the bottom before ever coming to this company which is why I am where I am today. Granted I am in a different "place" then a lot of posters on this board. I'm not saying I am better than anyone, but I do know a thing or two about how to get ahead, and that's not going to happen by turning your nose up and not starting out small. I've said my piece now. Take it or leave it, flame me, whatever.

[CTGirl]

No one ever wants to listen to me, because I don't know what I'm talking about :rolleyes: but again, I just want to throw out there again the benefits of often starting out somewhere for less money, or in a "stepping stone" position. Often if you are good at what you do, you WILL advance pretty quickly. And often the networking opportunities, which provide opportunities for advancement are endless. For example, my most entry-level positions here may only pay $10.00 an hour, but those staff are around doctors, psychologists, speech therapists, occupational therapists, etc. all day. They are learning valuable skills that can help them advance to the next level in the human services field. They are MEETING others in the field who can help them advance. They learn about openings in other agencies that may be a better fit, higher pay and great opportunity. I'll use myself as an example. I started out at this company in a P/T direct-care position, while working in a hellish F/T position somewhere else. I talked to my supervisor at the time about the time I was having elsewhere and they CREATED a F/T supervisory position for me here. Then, he left, and I got to be the Program Manager here. NOW, my boss is talking about letting me start a new program closer to where I live, in Long Island, which would be so much better for me down the road. Originally, I wanted to NOT take that P/T position, and originally, I didn't want to leave my last job because of feeling secure. I also started out at the bottom before ever coming to this company which is why I am where I am today. Granted I am in a different "place" then a lot of posters on this board. I'm not saying I am better than anyone, but I do know a thing or two about how to get ahead, and that's not going to happen by turning your nose up and not starting out small. I've said my piece now. Take it or leave it, flame me, whatever.

I agree, again.

In my current job search, I am applying both for jobs that are better than the one I currently have, and jobs that are at, or slightly below where I am now, but may be good developmental opportunities. You can't be a snob when you're looking for a job, you'll never get one.

[SmilesSoSweet]

Tell me about it. I have several friends right now who are thinking of moving to LA (they are musicians so it's understandable). But I don't see all the appeal either. Seems to me you'd be going from a big fish in a small pond to a tiny fish in a gigantic one.

Me, I've been considering Miami, San Diego, San Francisco, Chicago, DC, Atlanta, San Jose, maybe Phoenix.

Move to Phoenix!!! :)

[vivo]

also unlike other northeaastern cities, the DC area seems to be growing at a Sunbeltish pace ala phoenix etc.

[winneythepooh7]

I'm six weeks away from exhausting my unemployment. Beyond that, I have $14K in a savings account, about half of which I borrowed from a relative for non-unemployment things (buying some furniture and moving into a different apt. next year). I have $4K sitting in a mutual fund, earmarked for a down payment on a house, and about $4K in various IRAs. I could probably make all of this money last a year if I had to, but I don't know if I can stand to see all this money just drain away.

?

If you are unemployed, the last thing you should be thinking about is a down-payment on a house. Especially in NYC where houses (I mean apartments) are like $800K to start. But I guess I just have different priorities then you.........

[LaFille]

Bear in mind that there is a lot of mythology about certain places, too. I've actually never been to NYC. But I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that it's probably not the case that everyday life is like an episode of Friends, Sex in the City, or what have you.

Really, this is a pretty big country to narrow it down to one or two places being the end all-be all.

mmmhmmm... wherever you live, you still have to do laundry and clean your toilet. everyday life turns into everyday life wherever you are.

[Kitty]

I do think there are certain places that have a magic about them. It's probably different for everyone, but those places for me (within the US) are San Fran, NYC, Boston, and Seattle (of the places I've been). I understand why people are drawn to certain places over others...I like living in a City that is inspiring.

[The X]

I do think there are certain places that have a magic about them. It's probably different for everyone, but those places for me (within the US) are San Fran, NYC, Boston, and Seattle (of the places I've been). I understand why people are drawn to certain places over others...I like living in a City that is inspiring.
I understand you, I live in Syracuse, and a friend of mine runs a poetry open mic that I go to, she complains about how not many people go to it, I say well what do you expect Syracuse sucks and it's full of idiots, then she gets mad.

[Winter Storm]

I understand you, I live in Syracuse, and a friend of mine runs a poetry open mic that I go to, she complains about how not many people go to it, I say well what do you expect Syracuse sucks and it's full of idiots, then she gets mad.

Ah. I have a friend in Syracuse now. She said she went to the hottest club in town and nobody was there. :rolleyes:

[The X]

Ah. I have a friend in Syracuse now. She said she went to the hottest club in town and nobody was there. :rolleyes:
Yeah that's something I don't get. We have SU here, like 28 thousand students, mostly rich kids, and yet it always seems hardly anyone is out downtown. I don't know where they all go. (not saying I want a bunch of rich kids to hang out with either just pointing out something I wonder about).

[jrwilheim]

If you are unemployed, the last thing you should be thinking about is a down-payment on a house. Especially in NYC where houses (I mean apartments) are like $800K to start. But I guess I just have different priorities then you.........

I set aside that money as "house money" when I was employed, and even then it was a very long term goal...and by house I meant more a 1-br co-op in someplace like Jackson Heights or Prospect Heights. Or to buy something in, say, Philadelphia if I ever succeed in transferring my life there.

[Winter Storm]

Yeah that's something I don't get. We have SU here, like 28 thousand students, mostly rich kids, and yet it always seems hardly anyone is out downtown. I don't know where they all go. (not saying I want a bunch of rich kids to hang out with either just pointing out something I wonder about).

Well, my friend goes to SU, for its PHd program and one reason could be because she and all her class and labmates are up to their eyebrows in work. She doesn't even have time to take a shit these days, she goes from school to work to school to work to school....

[The X]

Well, my friend goes to SU, for its PHd program and one reason could be because she and all her class and labmates are up to their eyebrows in work. She doesn't even have time to take a shit these days, she goes from school to work to school to work to school....
Well that's a PHd so yeah, not much partying. But I went to UB, Buffalo, where the bar scene was huge.

[jrwilheim]

I've noticed that a lot of people apply to work at my agency who are barely qualified for my $10/hour positions, yet, want to be starting out as a Program Director. I don't want to offend you, but I have noticed you talk up your Columbia degree a lot. It's cool that you went to any Ivy-league school and all that, but still, when it comes down to it, are you actually qualified for the positions you are applying for? I remember from a lot of your threads that you've jumped around a lot and held temporary positions. Unfortunately, that often is going to make you look like a liability for many companies. I've found that usually the most successful people who advance quickly are the ones who will start out at the bottom and don't turn their nose up at entry-level stuff, especially if they are out of work. In this day and age, it's not about where you got your degree from, sorry to say........

Winney, I have done nothing BUT apply for entry-level positions. I am applying for entry-level administrative assistant positions. I think I am qualified to answer phones, file, fax, photocopy, schedule meetings, etc.

I have no qualms whatsoever about starting at the bottom someplace and working my way up. In fact, I am REALLY tired of running into people who think that because I haven't found a job yet, it must be because I've been picky or turned down offers or sniffed my nose up at things. The only temporary positions I've had lately have been like 1-day stints doing data entry for $10 an hour. I have not "jumped around"--I've been laid off.

[The X]

Winney, I have done nothing BUT apply for entry-level positions. I am applying for entry-level administrative assistant positions. I think I am qualified to answer phones, file, fax, photocopy, schedule meetings, etc.

I have no qualms whatsoever about starting at the bottom someplace and working my way up. In fact, I am REALLY tired of running into people who think that because I haven't found a job yet, it must be because I've been picky or turned down offers or sniffed my nose up at things. The only temporary positions I've had lately have been like 1-day stints doing data entry for $10 an hour. I have not "jumped around"--I've been laid off.
Yeah that's what I was saying, I've noticed winney has a habit of popping up in threads where people are complaining about job hunting, and she brags about how she hires people and how they're not qualified, I think just to make herself feel good, when her advice is worthless!

[winneythepooh7]

Yeah that's what I was saying, I've noticed winney has a habit of popping up in threads where people are complaining about job hunting, and she brags about how she hires people and how they're not qualified, I think just to make herself feel good, when her advice is worthless!

Um, I don't hire people who are not qualified. And again, if you think my advice is "worthless" good luck to you on your job search. And if what I'm saying doesn't apply to you, let it fly!

[pisces2473]

Yeah that's something I don't get. We have SU here, like 28 thousand students, mostly rich kids, and yet it always seems hardly anyone is out downtown. I don't know where they all go. (not saying I want a bunch of rich kids to hang out with either just pointing out something I wonder about).
That's how it is in New Haven, with Yale.

[pisces2473]

Yeah that's what I was saying, I've noticed winney has a habit of popping up in threads where people are complaining about job hunting, and she brags about how she hires people and how they're not qualified, I think just to make herself feel good, when her advice is worthless!
Excuse me. I'm a moderator here, and you're out of line. Winney is a breath of fresh air on these boards and is using her YEARS of working in the real world to HELP some of you. If you don't like her comments, you can put her on ignore status. Also, I find it interesting that you, "The X", have just joined and are seemingly fond of attacking Winney at every chance you can get.

What's the deal?

[CTGirl]

Um, I don't hire people who are not qualified. And again, if you think my advice is "worthless" good luck to you on your job search.

I'm with winney on this one, cuz she usually knows what she's talking about, and as someone who also does some hiring, I certainly agree with a lot of what she says about the process.

To the OP, I'm sorry that I too assumed that you had not been looking into entry-level positions, cuz that's a very common mistake that people make in their job searches.

[CTGirl]

That's how it is in New Haven, with Yale.

How do you figure that? I see buttloads of people out and about every night in New Haven......

[Kitty]

That's how it is in New Haven, with Yale.

Weird, that's how it is with Stanford/Palo Alto, too.

[The X]

Excuse me. I'm a moderator here, and you're out of line. Winney is a breath of fresh air on these boards and is using her YEARS of working in the real world to HELP some of you. If you don't like her comments, you can put her on ignore status. Also, I find it interesting that you, "The X", have just joined and are seemingly fond of attacking Winney at every chance you can get.

What's the deal?
I joined like 2 weeks ago, but was just waiting to be allowed to post. Not attacking her but it was something that bothered me for a while.

[WorkInProgress]

I joined like 2 weeks ago, but was just waiting to be allowed to post. Not attacking her but it was something that bothered me for a while.

Waiting to be allowed to post?

[winneythepooh7]

Thanks Jen and CTGirl. And also JRWilhem, I wasn't aware that you were looking for something entry-level. In any event, I am talking in general terms about what I see, since the majority of what I do each day is hire people. In fact this morning, I literally shreaded at least 150 resumes that have been piling up from people who must not have even read the job ads I've posted. I don't mind helping people and giving them constructive criticism as to what they may be doing "wrong" in their job search. I think this is something that EVERYONE can improve on, and something that many people just don't know about. And I also think that several people who post on these boards, their posts are very telling about why they probably haven't been able to find a job. Especially if you go back and look at previous posts and see it all there in black and white.

[pisces2473]

How do you figure that? I see buttloads of people out and about every night in New Haven......
You saw the people who were out that night we were downtown. The prissy 19 year olds all dressed up to go out to dinner? No thanks.

I mean, real people. That's what I want to see.

The X--what are you talking about, "waiting to post"???

[winneythepooh7]

I joined like 2 weeks ago, but was just waiting to be allowed to post. Not attacking her but it was something that bothered me for a while.

Well, if something bothers you, you can always send a little PM to me. Or notify a Mod if I or anyone else is out of line. And again, I DO this for a living. If you don't agree with me, again, that's your choice but there is no reason to be rude and immature about it.

[The X]

Waiting to be allowed to post?
Yeah I think maybe the moderator here has to approve people to post? I like looking at the threads here, but today when I logged on I could post.

And winney no hard feelings ok.

[winneythepooh7]

And winney no hard feelings ok.

Fine. If you stick around, you will see that I am not delibrately out to "get people". At the same time, I don't believe in sugar-coating the truth either. I think that people NEED constructive criticism to learn and grow and advance, both at work, and in their personal life. I've said this before but I cannot believe how dumb A LOT of people are in the job search. And it's basic common sense stuff I am talking about as well, not rocket science.

[CTGirl]

You saw the people who were out that night we were downtown. The prissy 19 year olds all dressed up to go out to dinner? No thanks.

I mean, real people. That's what I want to see.


Well, it depends where you're going I suppose, I tend to avoid the places that attract drunken teenage types, and have had no problem thus far finding places with a better crowd.

[The X]

Fine. If you stick around, you will see that I am not delibrately out to "get people". At the same time, I don't believe in sugar-coating the truth either. I think that people NEED constructive criticism to learn and grow and advance, both at work, and in their personal life. I've said this before but I cannot believe how dumb A LOT of people are in the job search. And it's basic common sense stuff I am talking about as well, not rocket science.
I hear you on the basic common sense stuff. At the same time I applied for lots of jobs I'm not technically qualified for, like I don't have the expereince it asks for. Just because you never know. Sorry you have to weed through resumes from people like me.

[J-girl]

I think it depends upon different fields. A lot of Technical jobs do NOT require all the experience they usually list in the job postings. My friend recruits for IT firms, and she said they just put that to get the smartest individual. They are just trying to be cheap since they will want a person with masters and they will list 45G as starting. And every field has different wage requirements. And being in computer science myself, if you know one application every one knows the other can be picked up in a few days. I am not sure how social service field works though in contrast to that.

At my job for instance, I am learning new applications/procedures/programs everyday. They are training me to be a part of the team that will grow with the company as opposed to just a warm body that knows A,B, and C.

[winneythepooh7]

I hear you on the basic common sense stuff. At the same time I applied for lots of jobs I'm not technically qualified for, like I don't have the expereince it asks for. Just because you never know. Sorry you have to weed through resumes from people like me.

I think luck has a lot to do with it, and sometimes depending on the job, certain things can be waived. But I honestly don't understand why people who meet NONE of the requirements of the position apply (ie. specifically asking for a Master's degree and direct experience doing A B C specific duties) and getting someone with barely a HS diploma who's never worked in their life applying, to say, be a Director of a company. And I am so not exagerrating either. The poor trees that have been killed with the amount of useless resumes that are sent to me.............

[pisces2473]

Well, it depends where you're going I suppose, I tend to avoid the places that attract drunken teenage types, and have had no problem thus far finding places with a better crowd.
I guess. It just seems like every where has crazy nutsy people. At night, that is.

[The X]

I think luck has a lot to do with it, and sometimes depending on the job, certain things can be waived. But I honestly don't understand why people who meet NONE of the requirements of the position apply (ie. specifically asking for a Master's degree and direct experience doing A B C specific duties) and getting someone with barely a HS diploma who's never worked in their life applying, to say, be a Director of a company. And I am so not exagerrating either. The poor trees that have been killed with the amount of useless resumes that are sent to me.............
Those people are stupid I agree, and I'm surprised that people actually apply for a director of a company and they haven't even passed high school.

[LaFille]

I think luck has a lot to do with it, and sometimes depending on the job, certain things can be waived. But I honestly don't understand why people who meet NONE of the requirements of the position apply (ie. specifically asking for a Master's degree and direct experience doing A B C specific duties) and getting someone with barely a HS diploma who's never worked in their life applying, to say, be a Director of a company. And I am so not exagerrating either. The poor trees that have been killed with the amount of useless resumes that are sent to me.............

i sometimes apply for jobs i am slightly underqualified for... but that is unbelievable. i would never apply to anything that requires a master's degree or anything more than a year or two of experience.

i posted my resume on some website or other and they always send me jobs that i am totally unqualified for as 'matches.' to use your term, director of a company or something similar. sometimes i want to apply for said jobs, just to be obnoxious. but i never do :rolleyes: i know it's not the actual company's fault that i get these notifications...

[winneythepooh7]

Those people are stupid I agree, and I'm surprised that people actually apply for a director of a company and they haven't even passed high school.

My assistant and I spend a great part of the day shaking our head at the types of resumes we get. Then it sometimes can still be slim pickins' when we actually do set up an interview because when you actually meet that person, you can see that they are not necessarily who you are looking for. A lot of people also cannot provide professional references at the interview either, which is another reason I won't hire someone. To give you some more examples of "stuff" I see:

1.) People show up in stained clothing.
2.) Women show up scantily clad with their boobs popping out of a tank top that's 4 sizes too small.
3.) People just sit there and don't respond at all to any of my questions and stare at me like a deer in the headlights.
4.) People don't show up at all for the interview and don't call.
5.) People cancel the interview via fax.
6.) People ignore the "no criminal background" and produce a criminal history a mile long.
7.) People tell me before they are offered the position that they can work the hours specified. After they go through the long hiring process, go through orientation and training are like "By the way, I can't work that schedule!"
8.) People just don't show up to work/call after they are hired.


and the most recent one:

Some guy a year ago put in his resignation that day, fell off the face of the planet. The company recently gets an "unemployment notice", yet does a background check and sees that he has been in prison for the past year.............

And you WONDER why I say the things I do about people trying to work here!!!! And these are all people trying to get a job in the human services field. It's very frightening!!!!

[jrwilheim]

Why is the only other option moving back home? Like wordsmith said, there are plenty of other cities that you can still live in and have your independence.

it sounds like you have enough in savings to make a transition to move to another city/state. Why not research other places?

NYC isn't the only place to be.

It's not that going home would necessarily be the only option. It's just that, when I'm not sure I really know what I'm doing, and my job prospects don't seem all that bright, I don't see a good reason to be spending all of this money--a big chunk of which isn't even really my money--to stay in an overpriced, overcrowded city that makes me miserable. And given that I don't have a clearly articulated plan B in terms of what I want to do, where I want to go, etc., going home seems like the sensible option.

I guess my bigger question is...at what point do you admit you've failed in your effort to establish an adult existence, gome home, and regroup?

[The X]

Yeah there are some real freaks out there. My sister works at police department, giving people background checks. She says most likely you'll see a normal button down nice looking guy and he will have all sorts of crazy crimes. Meanwhile the most broken down hobo guy will have a clean background. Can't judge a book I guess.

[pisces2473]

I guess my bigger question is...at what point do you admit you've failed in your effort to establish an adult existence, gome home, and regroup?
Why does it have to be a failure? Why can't you just want to change direction?

[winneythepooh7]

It's not that going home would necessarily be the only option. It's just that, when I'm not sure I really know what I'm doing, and my job prospects don't seem all that bright, I don't see a good reason to be spending all of this money--a big chunk of which isn't even really my money--to stay in an overpriced, overcrowded city that makes me miserable. And given that I don't have a clearly articulated plan B in terms of what I want to do, where I want to go, etc., going home seems like the sensible option.

I guess my bigger question is...at what point do you admit you've failed in your effort to establish an adult existence, gome home, and regroup?

If I didn't have so many committments here, I would happily move elsewhere. My fiance and I have actually talked about relocating out of state (maybe North Carolina, Arizona, Nevada) if he decides to give up his business. The cost of living here is insane. I am sure that I may need to take a slight paycut elsewhere to do what I do, but still...........as much as NY is a part of me, sometimes I get really sick of it. I guess what I am trying to say, is if you don't have any major committments here, and can go anywhere else, that maybe that would be a wise decision. As much as we forget it sometimes, there IS life outside of NYC ;).

[Kitty]

Can you get some sort of temp job while you look for a "real" job? I never really understood how people just decide that they'll ONLY look for jobs when they've been out of work for months. I mean, can't you wait tables? get a gig at starbucks?

[SmilesSoSweet]

It's not that going home would necessarily be the only option. It's just that, when I'm not sure I really know what I'm doing, and my job prospects don't seem all that bright, I don't see a good reason to be spending all of this money--a big chunk of which isn't even really my money--to stay in an overpriced, overcrowded city that makes me miserable. And given that I don't have a clearly articulated plan B in terms of what I want to do, where I want to go, etc., going home seems like the sensible option.

I guess my bigger question is...at what point do you admit you've failed in your effort to establish an adult existence, gome home, and regroup?

Honestly there isn't a "point" in time to determine that. It's whenever you want to move back home. Do what's best for you. And it's not failure at all. Can you even move back home? I know my parents have the open door policy with my brother, sister and me, but none of us have ever needed to move back home but we're fortunate that we can if we had to. But I also know a few people that once they move out, they can never move back home.

Oh and even when I had a stable job back in CA, I still didn't think it was feasible to be spending all my money in just rent and not getting anywhere which was why I decided to look elsewhere. Even if I moved back home, I still wouldn't have had many work options since I work in the building industry and Arizona has been booming with developments the last few years.

But it did take me over a year to finally make my move. Maybe you can move back home for a couple of months, regroup, and then make your decision as to whether to stay home and find a job there, or move some place else.

[Josie]

It's not that going home would necessarily be the only option. It's just that, when I'm not sure I really know what I'm doing, and my job prospects don't seem all that bright, I don't see a good reason to be spending all of this money--a big chunk of which isn't even really my money--to stay in an overpriced, overcrowded city that makes me miserable. And given that I don't have a clearly articulated plan B in terms of what I want to do, where I want to go, etc., going home seems like the sensible option.

I guess my bigger question is...at what point do you admit you've failed in your effort to establish an adult existence, gome home, and regroup?

Do you have any type of job at all right now? When you are looking for your "dream job" or even foot in the door entry-level job in your chosen field....one thing is for damn sure, and that's having at least some sort of job (be it retail, restaurant etc.) in the mean time. And yes, you put that on your resume because it shows that you are reliable, capable, dependable, and worthy of a job.

I'm sure there are a butt load of jobs on craigslist that you would be capable of doing. Perhaps they are not what you expected but that's life. That's adult life.

[WorkInProgress]

Honestly there isn't a "point" in time to determine that. It's whenever you want to move back home. Do what's best for you. And it's not failure at all. Can you even move back home? I know my parents have the open door policy with my brother, sister and me, but none of us have ever needed to move back home but we're fortunate that we can if we had to. But I also know a few people that once they move out, they can never move back home.

Oh and even when I had a stable job back in CA, I still didn't think it was feasible to be spending all my money in just rent and not getting anywhere which was why I decided to look elsewhere. Even if I moved back home, I still wouldn't have had many work options since I work in the building industry and Arizona has been booming with developments the last few years.

But it did take me over a year to finally make my move. Maybe you can move back home for a couple of months, regroup, and then make your decision as to whether to stay home and find a job there, or move some place else.

Good response.

[gysberger4]

I know that you all are trying to help out and give advice to someone who is having difficulties finding a job, but things are not as easy as some of you are making them out to be. I too have been out of work for months now and cannot get hired anywhere. I have had several interviews for administrative assistant positions, as well as interviews for positions in my field (climatology) only to be told that I am either a) overqualified or b) lacking experience. I am definately applying for bottom of the barrel positions and am still getting rejected left and right because I am too-educated and have too-much work experience (I have B.A. and M.A. degrees in Geography/Climatology).

Getting a job at a retail store or as a waitress/hostess doesn't seem right to be because what if I were to get hired for a position at a retail store or a restaurant and got hired for a full-time job that I really wanted and went to school for the next week? I just wouldn't feel right taking on a job like that to only dump it the second I got the job I really wanted. I just don't want to take on a job for the sake of having a job, I want to have a job that I can gain experience and one that will count as "real work experience".

[LaFille]

Getting a job at a retail store or as a waitress/hostess doesn't seem right to be because what if I were to get hired for a position at a retail store or a restaurant and got hired for a full-time job that I really wanted and went to school for the next week? I just wouldn't feel right taking on a job like that to only dump it the second I got the job I really wanted. I just don't want to take on a job for the sake of having a job, I want to have a job that I can gain experience and one that will count as "real work experience".

this is a dilemma, because you never know when you are going to have to leave that job, and for all the time you spend looking, you might have found something in your field. i lucked out by going back to a place where i had waitressed before, and they know i am looking for a job. do you know anyone who can help you out in this way? or what about temping and only taking short-term positions?

[SmilesSoSweet]

Getting a job at a retail store or as a waitress/hostess doesn't seem right to be because what if I were to get hired for a position at a retail store or a restaurant and got hired for a full-time job that I really wanted and went to school for the next week? I just wouldn't feel right taking on a job like that to only dump it the second I got the job I really wanted. I just don't want to take on a job for the sake of having a job, I want to have a job that I can gain experience and one that will count as "real work experience".

But what if your "what if I get a my dream job after I take a temp job" doesn't come up for a whole year? You're just not going to work for a full year just to wait around for something else? How do you survive on that?

I used to also think about the "what if" life. Now I just say screw it and I do what I want now instead of just wait around for something to happen.

Oh and also a lot of retail stores and restaurants have a high turnover rate on their employees because most know that the majority of them aren't working these jobs for their entire life. Some are just in transition.

[cameralady]

There's something on CareerBuilder right now that says that NYC is ranked at the top of worst cities to move to in terms of finding a career right now.

Since I am here in the trenches, I'd have to say that I agree with you.

It also states that median salary is like $42K per year. It's really hard to live on that here.
In Manhattan and other gentrified areas, heck yeah. However, I'd love to earn even that much! At the rate I'm going now, I'll be stuck at home indefinitely.

As much as I am pro-New York (and pro-Brooklyn), I'm seriously entertaining the idea of leaving town again (maybe for Philly). It's a shame that natives like me are being priced out of here.

By the way, jrwilheim, Philadelphia has a wage tax (http://www.phillyblog.com/philly/archive/index.php/t-914.html). If you get a job there, keep that in mind.

[yankeeyosh]

I've noticed that a lot of people apply to work at my agency who are barely qualified for my $10/hour positions, yet, want to be starting out as a Program Director.

DING DING DING DING...We have a winner...or shall I say, a 'Yer'! :)

I don't want to offend you, but I have noticed you talk up your Columbia degree a lot. It's cool that you went to any Ivy-league school and all that, but still, when it comes down to it, are you actually qualified for the positions you are applying for? I remember from a lot of your threads that you've jumped around a lot and held temporary positions. Unfortunately, that often is going to make you look like a liability for many companies. I've found that usually the most successful people who advance quickly are the ones who will start out at the bottom and don't turn their nose up at entry-level stuff, especially if they are out of work. In this day and age, it's not about where you got your degree from, sorry to say........

I agree with you...there are many, many incredibly well-qualified people who have gone to state schools and lesser known colleges. I was astounded over the intelligence of some of the kids who went to FSU. That said, unless you're a legacy (a totally different topic), you need to have some brains to get into an Ivy Leauge school. So while if all else is equal, I would definitely not pick someone who has an Ivy League diploma over someone who went to state school for a position, the fact is that someone with intelligence should have an opportunity to acquire a decent job and be able to use his/her brain to some capacity. It doesn't matter if you went to Harvard or SUNY-Podunk. That's what I think his point was.

[yankeeyosh]

Those people are stupid I agree, and I'm surprised that people actually apply for a director of a company and they haven't even passed high school.

Well, I don't know about that, but there are a gajillion 23 year olds out there with ink barely dry on their diplomas and who have worked in a professional environment just a few months who think they deserve to be manager or at least have a "huge office".

It also states that median salary is like $42K per year. It's really hard to live on that here.

If you dont' have a car and your student loans are manageable, you can do it with some ease (albeit probably with roommates and maybe a rat). If you have a car, forget about it.

Anyway, I'm gonna get out of the Northeast someday. I think the only reason I'm still here is because I want to be close to my father, who is not in good health. I'd like to move down south...perhaps to Richmond or the Carolinas. It's too expensive here (not to mention cold)...if I lived down south, I might have a fighting chance to actually be able to own a place.

[winneythepooh7]

DING DING DING DING...We have a winner...or shall I say, a 'Yer'! :)





Honestly Mark, I think a lot of people who apply are even much older then I am. I don't think generations play a major part in the person being unqualified. They are unqualified people of all ages.

[jrwilheim]

By the way, jrwilheim, Philadelphia has a wage tax (http://www.phillyblog.com/philly/archive/index.php/t-914.html). If you get a job there, keep that in mind.

And that would be different from our New York City income tax how?

[jrwilheim]

Why does it have to be a failure? Why can't you just want to change direction?

Because this is what people in their twenties have done since time immemorial--get a job, move out on their own, pay their own way through life, not be dependent on family any more. For goodness sakes, my cousin, who's two years younger than me is married and supporting three kids, and I'm not even able to support myself. How can that not feel like failure?

[jrwilheim]

Do you have any type of job at all right now? When you are looking for your "dream job" or even foot in the door entry-level job in your chosen field....one thing is for damn sure, and that's having at least some sort of job (be it retail, restaurant etc.) in the mean time. And yes, you put that on your resume because it shows that you are reliable, capable, dependable, and worthy of a job.

I'm sure there are a butt load of jobs on craigslist that you would be capable of doing. Perhaps they are not what you expected but that's life. That's adult life.

Okay...I have looked for that kind of job. Barnes & Noble will not take me at this point--"overqualified" (read: we expect to train him and have him be gone in three weeks). And please tell me: if I have that kind of job, exactly when am I supposed to go on interviews for anything else?

[wordsmith]

Because this is what people in their twenties have done since time immemorial--get a job, move out on their own, pay their own way through life, not be dependent on family any more. For goodness sakes, my cousin, who's two years younger than me is married and supporting three kids, and I'm not even able to support myself. How can that not feel like failure?

But you more than likely could support yourself if you relocated to someplace with a lower cost of living and less competition for jobs.

You for some reason seem to think that paying your own way through life only counts if it's done successfully in one of the most expensive places you could possibly have picked to live. TONS of perfectly successful people wouldn't be able to make it in such an expensive place, for many legitimate reasons. I'd never consider locating there, myself. My fields of interest just don't pay what I'd need to make. There's no reason that's "failure."

[SmilesSoSweet]

Because this is what people in their twenties have done since time immemorial--get a job, move out on their own, pay their own way through life, not be dependent on family any more. For goodness sakes, my cousin, who's two years younger than me is married and supporting three kids, and I'm not even able to support myself. How can that not feel like failure?

And how do you know that your younger cousin is happy supporting his three kids?

Who says that's success. And who gets to define failure? I have a few cousins that got married early and had kids and as much as they are now doing well (not necessarily well off) as in they can support their families, I don't in anyway want to be in their position right now.

You can't compare apples to oranges. Focus on what you want to do. And what wordsmith said, you can be completely successful in any other city it doesn't have to be NYC, LA, SF, Boston, etc.

[pisces2473]

Because this is what people in their twenties have done since time immemorial--get a job, move out on their own, pay their own way through life, not be dependent on family any more. For goodness sakes, my cousin, who's two years younger than me is married and supporting three kids, and I'm not even able to support myself. How can that not feel like failure?
OH MY GOD.

Dude, if everyone was doing this, do you think this site would exist??? HECK NO! I, for one, would be too busy running after my kids and getting them off to school, probably!

Everyone has a different hoe to row in life. Just because you aren't at the level of your cousin, who cares? You could be WORSE off. Don't compare yourself to him, as I'm sure he's not trying to survive in NYC. I really think you need to consider moving elsewhere. That's not a failure. That's moving on and finding new things. Many people move, change careers, etc. Failure is when you give up and sit in a dark room, waiting to die.

[winneythepooh7]

OH MY GOD.

Dude, if everyone was doing this, do you think this site would exist??? HECK NO! I, for one, would be too busy running after my kids and getting them off to school, probably!

Everyone has a different hoe to row in life. Just because you aren't at the level of your cousin, who cares? You could be WORSE off. Don't compare yourself to him, as I'm sure he's not trying to survive in NYC. I really think you need to consider moving elsewhere. That's not a failure. That's moving on and finding new things. Many people move, change careers, etc. Failure is when you give up and sit in a dark room, waiting to die.


You said it! Comparing oneself to others is useless behavior. You really don't know how happy your cousin or anyone else for that matter is with their life. I am sure there are people who wish they could be in your shoes, with a large savings, a good degree, and good health. And from what I remember of your posts, a supportive family as well. These are just some things many people take for granted that so many people do not have.

[Josie]

Okay...I have looked for that kind of job. Barnes & Noble will not take me at this point--"overqualified" (read: we expect to train him and have him be gone in three weeks). And please tell me: if I have that kind of job, exactly when am I supposed to go on interviews for anything else?

For reals, on your barnes and noble application, don't put down that you are a college grad and that you only want the job until you find something else. And when you have interviews for real jobs, they usually do try to set up an interview time that you are able to make. As far as I know, b&n isn't giving out 7 day a week shifts.

[jrwilheim]

For reals, on your barnes and noble application, don't put down that you are a college grad and that you only want the job until you find something else. And when you have interviews for real jobs, they usually do try to set up an interview time that you are able to make. As far as I know, b&n isn't giving out 7 day a week shifts.

Actually, I worked at Barnes and Noble for a short period (literally 2 weeks) a couple years ago, and my having gone to Columbia was actually a plus. It's what got me an interview at B&N when I applied in June. Unlike McDonalds and the like, being educated is seen as a plus there because you understand something about books, can make recommendations to customers if they ask, etc. What killed me was their knowing I left B&N so quickly for another position last time (a paralegal job I was more qualified for), which is kept in their local (and possibly nationwide) system. That's the sense in which I'm "overqualified"--I've done more "professional" jobs before, etc.

[red]

actually i moved to chicago right out of school. lived there for a year or so doing odd jobs (walking dogs, waiting tables, working at a spa, etc.) and then travelled a bit and moved back to ny. honestly, i don't see it as a failure at all. just part of the journey. i guess it's a little different for me since i grew up less than 50 miles from where i live now. you really can't compare yourself to other people though.

we've talked a lot about leaving nyc but it would be harder for my husband (who has never lived anywhere else) than it would be for me. but i mean, you're not in dire straits yet, so now might be a good time to explore other options and cities. i do agree that the job market here is oversaturated, but when the job market sucked for me, i found something to do in the interim.

[Musicvixen24]

I'm sorry but you are pretty well off, there is no need to give up. I just moved to miami from nyc and i know that you can do anything. it's true you have enough mone to make job hunting full time. there are THOUSANDS of opportunities for every field, you just can't get discouraged.
How come no ones telling me this about miami, i need a pick me up myself lol

[AshleyJordan]

In my experience, cliche as it sounds, there are more opportuntiies here than pretty much anywhere else (and I've looked at relocating, and I'm on the lower end of the salary spectrum and I have tremendous student loan debt.) At the end of the day, it can be really tough living in NYC, but I also think if you really hustle, you can do better here than anywhere else. Or, at least that's what I tell myself to justify my long subway rides and crappy apartment!

[winneythepooh7]

I'm hiring if anyone in NYC is looking for a job. P/T-Per Diem gigs.

[jrwilheim]

I'm hiring if anyone in NYC is looking for a job. P/T-Per Diem gigs.

Winney,

What do you need someone to do? I'd be glad to work for you/your agency. Just let me know.