Where to draw the line....

[enigma]

I posted about this before, but I figured I would start a new post.

Since the beginning of the semester, the guy I have been dating for 10 months (5 serious) has been SWAMPED with school. We went from spending fantastic quality time together on weekends to only getting together 1-2 times a month. Eventually it got to me and I confronted him on it a couple of weeks ago.

The conversation completely took him by surprise... He was pretty firm that school was his priority, and although he saw something happening with us, he didn't have any time to put into developing things further. He said he didn't know when he would have time. I told him that as much as I liked him, I didn't think this would work for me anymore. Ultimately, he said he would like a week or so to think about things...

Well a few weeks went by and I was feeling pretty good about standing up for myself. Then he sent me an e-mail saying he was wanting to talk. I replied that unless something had changed I didn't see what there else there was to discuss... he replied with some incredibly vague answer but basically said that his head was still in his books and that maybe one day it'll look up and be lonely.... I told him that if there was something he wanted to talk about, I would be willing. He response came off that he was definitely confused, and he said he wished he had given me a bigger hug...

I just don't know what to about him. We haven't spoken at all for two weeks. We have exchanged a couple of e-mails... During our conversation he sounded very firm in his "school is my priority" idea... but the few e-mails since then have sound very confused with a lot of 'I guess...'

He's really important to me, and I know I'm the closest person to him right now... so as much as I don't want to walk away from him, I can't see myself dating him so sporadically for an unknown period of time.

I wish I knew when to walk away and when to be more patient...

[winneythepooh7]

I've been swamped with F/T school, F/T work and F/T internship and still made an effort to be with the person I was with at the time, as well as managed to pull off some sort of a social life. I honestly feel it's weak if he's not making more of an effort to be with you. I mean, I can understand being busy to an extent, but if you really want to be with someone, you make the effort, even if it's once a week. If this was me, this would be a deal-breaker.

[WorkInProgress]

From this (and what I recall from the other thread), I think I'd cut this one loose. You want different things, and that doesn't seem to be changing. You both deserve better.

If you can be actual for real platonic friends, I'd try to go for that. If you can't, I wouldn't.

[weary]

i am sorry you're going through this and i know it sucks, but i honestly believe that we make time for what's important to us. be it reading, eating, dating or anything in between. i'm not saying you're not at all important to him. but i think that his actions show where he is, even if he's saying that it's just that school is the priority right now. making school a priority is certainly respectable.

but unless you guys live a significant distance from eachother...the amount of time you guys have for eachother dwindling like you explained in your post is just too much. even when i dated a guy going for his PhD, he found time all the way through his thesis. sometimes i would just be like, "i know you have a ton of work to do but i really want to see you. can i just stop by on my way to ____ and give you a kiss?" he almost always obliged. other times we would order take out and eat together, then he'd go right back to the books and i'd read or watch TV or something. it wasn't much, but it was something. just being in the same space helped.

it doesn't sound like this dude is giving you anything, and this is after you've talked about it. i say cut your losses now.

sorry.

[enigma]

He blames a lot of it on poor time-management skills... but if he wants me in his life he will have to make room.

Up until a few weeks ago I was 'tolerating' his lack of time. This is the first two weeks that I haven't 'been' there. I can tell from the e-mails that he is really starting to miss me... but that isn't my problem.

Arg. I know is waiting for a response to the "I wish I would have given you a bigger hug e-mail."

At this point, he either steps up to the plate or doesn't... and I cannot wait around for him to decide.

[WorkInProgress]

He blames a lot of it on poor time-management skills... but if he wants me in his life he will have to make room.

Up until a few weeks ago I was 'tolerating' his lack of time. This is the first two weeks that I haven't 'been' there. He knows that he either makes the time or doesn't. I can tell from the e-mails that he is really confused...

That is no excuse. At all. And I find that more insulting than no excuse at all, actually.

[MetFanL]

If he wants to be with you, he'll make the time. It's as simple as that. If he's indecisive about it, he's just prolonging the inevitable.

Walk away now before you get any deeper. It's gonna hurt and it's gonna suck, but you gotta do what's right for YOU here, not just what's right for him.

[Kitty]

From this (and what I recall from the other thread), I think I'd cut this one loose. You want different things, and that doesn't seem to be changing. You both deserve better.


I agree. It's only going to get worse if you try to prolong it and drag out the relationship.

[CTGirl]

The bottom line is that if this guy's not meeting your needs, then you're better off just cutting him off and finding someone who will.

A lack of time is no excuse for not being there for someone - I dated a guy who lived over an hour away, and we were both working and going to school (and had different schedules) but we were still able to be there for one another.

If he can't make you one of his top priorities (he can have more than one) then you shouldnt make him one of yours. At some point, you've really gotta do what's best for you.

[winneythepooh7]

Don't make someone a priority who only makes you an option............

[weary]

Don't make someone a priority who only makes you an option............

can we get a "quote of the day" feature?

and this one from winney needs to go in there!!!

[winneythepooh7]

can we get a "quote of the day" feature?

and this one from winney needs to go in there!!!

I can't remember where I saw this quote, but it's definitely one of my faves!

[Krishna]

It sounds like you're not getting what you want, aren't happy, and therefore could probably do better for yourself. I vote with the others. Cut your losses for now.

[enigma]

When I posted this, I knew what the response would be!

Hey, no congratulations on putting my foot down with my guy? ;):

Obviously you all know how difficult it is to let someone go when you care about them. What I keep reminding myself is that I actually felt HAPPIER after I let him go... the hardest part is the loss of 'possibility' and knowing I won't have any more fantastic times with him...

[WorkInProgress]

Congrats on putting your foot down!

And yeah, it blows to lose that daydream/fantasy/possibility.

[MetFanL]

When I posted this, I knew what the response would be!

Hey, no congratulations on putting my foot down with my guy? ;):

Obviously you all know how difficult it is to let someone go when you care about them. What I keep reminding myself is that I actually felt HAPPIER after I let him go... the hardest part is the loss of 'possibility' and knowing I won't have any more fantastic times with him...
I (we) get it. We've all been there which is why we see all the signs. You were right and he very well could decide to make the time for you. But, it is a choice and he, currently, isn't making it. And, that is unfair to you. He's stringing you along -- intentionally or not.

You did the right thing here and that's not always the easy thing. Quite often, it's the hard thing. Be proud that you had the strength to it and know that, in doing it, you've made yourself available to someone who WANTS to make time for you because that's what you deserve.

[Kitty]

well, you know you did the right thing if you felt better after you did it.

Congrats on being strong! It's definitely not easy.

[Deavan]

When I posted this, I knew what the response would be!

Hey, no congratulations on putting my foot down with my guy? ;):

Obviously you all know how difficult it is to let someone go when you care about them. What I keep reminding myself is that I actually felt HAPPIER after I let him go... the hardest part is the loss of 'possibility' and knowing I won't have any more fantastic times with him...


yeah dont dwell on the "loss of possibility" that is just silly because now you have endless amounts of possibility once you hit the dating world again.

[enigma]

I do feel like he was doing his absolute best and giving me everything he could. I think a lot of it comes to whatever is holding him back. He finds it easier to stick his head in the books.

I honestly think he thought I would stick around until HE figured things out...

[WorkInProgress]

I honestly think he thought I would stick around until HE figured things out...

And that is crappy taking your for granted behavior.

[winneythepooh7]

As much as it's hurt, when I was in similar situations, I always felt better afterwards myself. I would rather know if it's not going anywhere, then wait around for the inevitable.

[enigma]

yeah dont dwell on the "loss of possibility" that is just silly because now you have endless amounts of possibility once you hit the dating world again.

Well whenever we were together we would have the most amazing times... so giving that 'idea' is hard.

I do, however, look forward to meeting someone new.... now the question will be how to do this...

[dostoy]

I have matured a bit, but I must say back in college I wanted to see a girl less, and not cause a confrontation, so I used school as an excuse, while I wasn't really that busy with college, I just had other problems to deal with I guess.

[enigma]

I have matured a bit, but I must say back in college I wanted to see a girl less, and not cause a confrontation, so I used school as an excuse, while I wasn't really that busy with college, I just had other problems to deal with I guess.

Trust me, he is really busy with school. I've known this kid for 2 years now... When we were dating I got daily digests about how he was only sleeping 4 hours a night, and EXACTLY how many pages he had to read before class the next day. Several of them were about how much he was freaking out about how stressed he was...

[wordsmith]

As you know, I cut a guy loose this summer who, due to (like in your situation) perfectly understandable circumstances, wouldn't/couldn't manage to devote the time I wanted/needed/felt I deserved. I dated him sporadically for about 8 months before it got to the point where I was really dissatisfied with not being made a priority or any kind. And at least in your/his case, school will eventually be over. Being a single dad who doesn't know how to or doesn't care to bother to balance kids and a personal life isn't something that's going to eventually stop.

I can't say it was easy or made me feel better, but I definitely felt better just closing the door on it than I did sitting and wondering why I didn't matter enough to try to find a way to spend time with a little more regularly. I was flexible, I was adaptible, I did things on his terms. I went about it in the right way. He just didn't. And so it couldn't go on anymore.

[MetFanL]

Trust me, he is really busy with school. I've known this kid for 2 years now... When we were dating I got daily digests about how he was only sleeping 4 hours a night, and EXACTLY how many pages he had to read before class the next day. Several of them were about how much he was freaking out about how stressed he was...
I don't think anyone is saying he isn't genuinely busy.

I'm just saying that if he wanted to be with you, he'd make the time. Period.

I know that my litmus test for dating a guy is "would I rearrange/skip the gym for him?" That's how I know I care -- I MAKE TIME.

My ex had a lot of "potential," to. Chr*st, we talked about kids and family and all that stuff. However, in the end, he wasn't committing for whatever reason and I had to walk away. Do I wish he would have stepped up? Of course. But he didn't and that's his loss.

This guy choose school. His loss.

[enigma]

I know that my litmus test for dating a guy is "would I rearrange/skip the gym for him?" That's how I know I care -- I MAKE TIME.

This what made the decision so hard for me. I know he gave up everything BUT school to see me. He made me a bigger priority than his friends AND work. I know seveal times he would drop work projects so he could spend time with me.

However, in the end, he wasn't committing for whatever reason and I had to walk away. Do I wish he would have stepped up? Of course. But he didn't and that's his loss.

BUT, he ultimately my guy didn't step up either. He allowed himself to fill up his school schedule to the absolute MAXIMUM. He's taking 21 credits in college, which is ridiculous. He said he took that much so he could learn how to time-manage...

[winneythepooh7]

I don't think anyone is saying he isn't genuinely busy.

I'm just saying that if he wanted to be with you, he'd make the time. Period.

I know that my litmus test for dating a guy is "would I rearrange/skip the gym for him?" That's how I know I care -- I MAKE TIME.

My ex had a lot of "potential," to. Chr*st, we talked about kids and family and all that stuff. However, in the end, he wasn't committing for whatever reason and I had to walk away. Do I wish he would have stepped up? Of course. But he didn't and that's his loss.

This guy choose school. His loss.

Yes. What she said. I also knew that my SO was "the one" because he is probably the busiest person I know in my life, yet when I was living in Queens and he was living in Long Island, he'd work 16 hour days and still make the drive to come see me. There were times yes when a week or so would go by and we didn't see each other. But he'd still call and stay in constant contact. And still talk about the future.

[enigma]

And at least in your/his case, school will eventually be over.

He has plans to get his PhD.. if he only had a couple of years left it would be one thing....

[winneythepooh7]

He has plans to get his PhD.. if he only had a couple of years left it would be one thing....

People get divorced over this kind of stuff though. There comes a point where the SO needs to be made priority. What if you were married and had children? Would he just blow all of you off? I know that's an extreme example, but it's relevant IMO.

[enigma]

People get divorced over this kind of stuff though. There comes a point where the SO needs to be made priority. What if you were married and had children? Would he just blow all of you off? I know that's an extreme example, but it's relevant IMO.

Oh, exactly! I actually had a talk with my boss about it... and she said that the most succesful people at life know how to time manage... for some reason this guy cannot concentrate on more than one thing.

[wordsmith]

He has plans to get his PhD.. if he only had a couple of years left it would be one thing....

It's still conceivable that one day, he will possibly be past this point in his life where everthing has to be rigidly structured toward that goal. In my situation, dude was never going to learn how to be a guy who can split time between a new GF and his family (or figure out a way for the two to share time) if he hadn't already.

[Chameleon]

You made the right choice, enigma and kudos on talking to him about it.

I think some people are being a little hard on the guy though - he wants to succeed at school, it's not like he's playing video games or chosing to be a gym rat over seeing her. Maybe he does need that much time to do well in school. Would you rather he dropped out just to be with her? I'm sure if he had it in him to make enigma happy and to do as well as he would like at school, he would do both. That's not a reason for enigma to hang around torturing herself because he couldn't give her what she needs to feel happy in the relationship though. There is only so much bending to someone else's circumstances that one can sanely do. Sh!t happens.

[Kitty]

I agree that if someone isn't making you a number 1 priority now, they probably won't ever make you a 1 priority. If it's not the PhD it will be the career..etc.

[WorkInProgress]

You made the right choice, enigma and kudos on talking to him about it.

I think some people are being a little hard on the guy though - he wants to succeed at school, it's not like he's playing video games or chosing to be a gym rat over seeing her. Maybe he does need that much time to do well in school. Would you rather he dropped out just to be with her? I'm sure if he had it in him to make enigma happy and to do as well as he would like at school, he would do both. That's not a reason for enigma to hang around torturing herself because he couldn't give her what she needs to feel happy in the relationship though. There is only so much bending to someone else's circumstances that one can sanely do. Sh!t happens.

I don't think anyone said he was a horrible person.

[Kitty]

I don't think anyone said he was a horrible person.

Yeah, I don't think anything negative was said about him at all.

[wordsmith]

You made the right choice, enigma and kudos on talking to him about it.

I think some people are being a little hard on the guy though - he wants to succeed at school, it's not like he's playing video games or chosing to be a gym rat over seeing her. Maybe he does need that much time to do well in school. Would you rather he dropped out just to be with her? I'm sure if he had it in him to make enigma happy and to do as well as he would like at school, he would do both. That's not a reason for enigma to hang around torturing herself because he couldn't give her what she needs to feel happy in the relationship though. There is only so much bending to someone else's circumstances that one can sanely do. Sh!t happens.

No, I think I do get it. In my parallel example, the guy prioritized time raising his kids over all else. Like you can really argue with somebody being a standup dad. And, no, I didn't want him to drop his kid obligations in favor of me. I would have liked to see him, at most, try to make the two work, maybe sometimes simultaneously if need be (not at first, but we were together long enough that I felt like if he wasn't introducing me to his kids, he wasn't planning to). Of course it wasn't as if he could bend to my circumstances, I'm a person without the obligation of children I'm raising, he's not in that position. He wasn't a bad guy, but he was in a situation where he couldn't give me what I needed to feel happy, either.

Like enigma, I can't fault him for the things that made him unable to step up. But I also couldn't pretend it was working for me, either.

[enigma]

Like enigma, I can't fault him for the things that made him unable to step up. But I also couldn't pretend it was working for me, either.

I know that we shouldn't take the guys behavior as personal, because its not. I think a lot of people assumed that I wasn't important to him. I know I was because I was the closest person to him... and meant a lot to him.

BUT exactly what WS said... I can't fault him for making school important, but I cannot pretend it is working for me. I was really starting to become unhappy with the situation.

[winneythepooh7]

I know that we shouldn't take the guys behavior as personal, because its not. I think a lot of people assumed that I wasn't important to him. I know I was because I was the closest person to him... and meant a lot to him.

BUT exactly what WS said... I can't fault him for making school important, but I cannot pretend it is working for me. I was really starting to become unhappy with the situation.

This was my whole point as well. I am sure he's a great guy, but if it's not working for you, it's not working. There's no need to try to make it work. And like Kitty said, if it ain't school, it's going to be work or something else next time.

[enigma]

There's no need to try to make it work. And like Kitty said, if it ain't school, it's going to be work or something else next time.

Exactly. It's incredibly frustrating to see how happy he is with me. Even his family has noticed... but there will always be SOMETHING in his way.

[Brillo25]

I feel what you said about the "loss of possibility." It's what made me hang on for so long to the military girl that was never making time for me. I put up with the situation for so long because of the "possibility" that we would spend more time together in the future and it will be worth the wait. And one of the first things I had trouble with after it recently apparently broke off, was bemoaning the loss of that possiblity that I held out so long for. But after so many months and few glimmers of hope that anything will ever be different, you've got to accept it eventually and try to find someone who makes an effort.

Winney's quote I thought was phenominal, and applied so directly to my situation too, "Don't make someone a priority who only makes you an option." I was somewhere on the list of things to do, but she never made any special effort to squeeze me in, and I was a slave to her tight work/social schedule. Often I was merely allowed to tag along. And she never thought of going two weeks without communicating as any big deal.

It's hard to let go of someone you had such high hopes for though. It's like a huge project that you slaved over for a long time but never completed.

[wordsmith]

Same with me. I'm pretty dogged and stubborn about not letting go of something when I've determined that it should work out.

[enigma]

A HUGE reason I think I let it go on as long as it did, is because I rarely find guys I really seem to 'connect' with. So when I found someone, I held on tight.

I felt a HUGE sense of relief when I let go of it... sure I'm still sad sometimes but then I think about how stressed I have been these last two months and am confident I did the right thing.

[Kitty]

It seems like you're doing an awesome job of keeping a level head. I am horrible in situations like this because I always doubt myself and get so confused between my emotions and my thoughts.