Bullying and its impact

[wordsmith]

Some mention on other threads brought this to mind, as well as time spent working with kids, and having family members who do as well...I wanted to see what types of experiences people have had with bullying, and ways in which they feel it may or may not have had any effect on them.

Were you bullied, ever (using any definition you like)? Were you ever the bully? What did any of this mean for you, if anything? Do you think that it's something that significantly affected you?

[Krishna]

I wouldnt say this had a significant impact on me, but I was definately bullied. I would also say that I bullied others both directly and indirectly through my actions (or lack there of).

[capella]

Nice topic. Yes, I was bullied and Yes, I was a bully (once). I was often picked on by kids in elementary school.

There was one time in middle school where there was a girl who was worse off socially than I was. She was really, really mean. It wasn't right, but I picked on her along with everyone else. It made me feel a little better about myself for a little while, but I regretted it later.

I had some experiences with really jerky bullies in high school. But nothing that was too permanently scarring. I was old enough to know they were just assholes who weren't going anywhere. And I was right. High school sucks anyhow and I would have been a brooding teenager bullying or no bullying. I think it's more damaging when you're a little kid.

I see it a lot with kids in school. I know that when I picked on that girl it was because I wanted her to be picked on NOT me. So I joined in. I knew I was wrong, but that didn't matter to me then.

When I see ring leaders in my class and their followers I try to talk to them about why they're being mean and what they ought to do instead. I will talk to the group and talk to the individuals. I really try to separate the pack because most bullies won't act alone. They need an audience and supporters.

[winneythepooh7]

Interesting topic! Yes, I was bullied. I remember hating to ride the school bus because there were several kids on there that picked on me. Why? I don't really know. I guess because I wasn't part of their "group" or lived on their road. Also, a lot of these kids were related (cousins and such). I still think about it even to this day and shudder. Also good old Myspace: seeing some of the people I went to school with who didn't necessarily bully me, however, never included me because I wasn't part of "their crowd" still brings back bad memories. I was watching (don't laugh) that Lifetime movie, Odd Girl Out (I think that's the title) the other night, and it really brought back bad memories of how mean girls especially can be. I still remember the ring-leader in "my group" who could turn on me (or anyone else) at the drop of a dime. And then she would get the boys to pick on me (or her target du jour) and that was just plain horrible. But no matter how mean she was to me, she could also be super nice and I always "took her back" when she changed into a nice person again. What I think about to this day as well, is what it would have been like if I was say, in the kids on the bus's group and not on the receiving end of their bullying. I've gotten over this by this point in my life, but still a part of me would love to go on some cheesy reunion show to give them a piece of my mind! I also never really had a boyfriend in highschool and I still contribute it to the fact that it had to do with things the mean set of kids on the bus felt or said about me. Once I got into college, life wasn't like that anymore.

[yankeeyosh]

I was bullied throughout my school career...from elementary through college. The worst was my freshman year of high school. I was beaten up, I had stuff stolen from me, I had stuff of mine broken, I had white-out thrown all over me, I was chased, I was given wedgies, and worst of all, I was called the most vile, atrocious names you could think of, EVERY FUCKING DAY (let's just say this...their favorite name they called me has to do with a private part on a male's body). My father had to drive from Queens to the Bronx every week...a 45 minute commute...to talk to the dean. The worst of it lasted a year, from MAR 93 to around APR 94. It settled down after that point...maybe because it was getting old, or maybe because the first two Gen 'Y' classes (96 and 97) were probably getting concerned about college admissions and didn't want anything to mess it up.

I like Generation 'X', but the classes of 93 and 94 at my school, I can never forgive.

To this day, I think some side effects are still felt.

[wordsmith]

I would have to say I bore for some of my childhood some minor bullying, but no more than most run of the mill kids do. I rode the school bus that was the one in the district that was the most handed off like a hot potato, because of the caliber of kids on it, for the most part. Really bad behavior, a lot of bullying, defiant, behavioral problem kids...our longest term bus driver was a big burly ex trucker, because he instilled the most fear, but sometimes that wasn't enough. Although most of the kids on our bus were pretty roughneck, I was a quiet, well-behaved, bookish kid...I'd read pretty much the whole bus trip, every day. There was a group or two of kids who would more or less go down the line and pick on whoever they felt like on a given day, and sometimes it was my turn. I remember getting a HUGE chunk of my hair ripped out, for utterly no reason, while I was minding my own business, reading a book, when one fo the girls walked by. But those weren't cases where I was singled out, it was just, I was the random choice of the day sometimes. So while you'd think that would be scarring, it was, strangely, kinda par for the course, it happened to everyone on our bus.

When I was in 5th-7th grade, for about three school years, I DID get singled out, though, targeted by a group of girl bullies...unlike the girls on the bus, who were the type of girls you see on Maury doing paternity test and crying about their fat babies, these girls didn't physically assault me...it was all emotionally bullying, which child psych can tell you is FAR more common for girls, especially of that age. They won't pull your hair or punch you in the face...well, they might, but that's not the harshest weapon of the middle school aged girl. Cruelty, ostracism, exclusion, cutting somebody from the herd...those are the weapons of choice for preteen and early teeenage girls. And honestly, I'd rather get punched.

There were a few reasons I was targeted...I wrote about it once in a writing circle, I'll cut and paste:

I was studious, but I was also imaginative, which made people want to play with me at recess…a circle of kind of oddball, fringy friends started this way, and grew from there. Except for a stretch of time, about 5th grade to 7th grade, when a group of girl bullies had it in for me, I was pretty well-liked, and didn’t have a ton of school social trauma. Basically, the reason the girl bullies had it in for me was because I did very well in school, almost every teacher I ever had liked me a lot, and regardless of the fact that I befriended a lot of the kids who didn’t have any other friends, most peers liked me.

I got pulled form a lot of regular classes early on in elementary school to take gifted/talented classes, and that was awesome, because of all the cool things I got to do - I was on an Odyssey of the Mind team when I was in 5th grade that advanced to the World Finals competition. It was awesome, a great opp, but it also came at a time when it set me apart from the other kids, and also had a bit to do with why I got picked on for a while there.

Although it seemed awful at the time, I wasn’t too adversely affected in the long run by being bullied. I never got beaten up, or anything, just mainly verbally abused, taunted, and embarrassed. And, amazingly, it never hugely dented my self confidence. I basically never really lost sight of the fact that they were jerks and there was nothing wrong with me (would not have been possible prob, were it not for excellent parenting in my arsenal). Eventually, they got bored with not really getting too much of a reaction, and moved on to other people. But, damn, three years!

There was one girl in the group of bullies who came to my church whenever she was staying weekends with her dad and stepmom, and we would hang out and play together, and I remember thinking that things would change, and the girls would at least leave me alone, though I didn’t want to be their friends. But then, at school she would act like we weren’t friends, and join in with the picking on me. That taught me a lot about loyalty.

I wouldn't say that I escaped totally unscathed, since I'm writing about it at age 29, but I didn't go all trenchcoat mafia, or become a social cripple or anything (again, kudos to good parenting). It all died down, for the most part, pretty early on and without fanfare, when the girls finally got bored with picking at me, and probably just found some other target who reacted more strongly/was more entertaining.

I'd say, for the most part, the effect it had on me was to NEVER pick on other kids, or use cruelty and ostracism against others (although I was raised not to operate that way, so it wasn't a big worry, anyhow). It made me have NO PATIENCE for "mean girls" in my circle of friends, from then up to now...something I hold to to this day. When I was a youth worker, my most clear cut rule is YOU MAY NOT exclude, shun, pick on other kids in the group. You MAY NOT make other people feel like they don't belong. Unacceptable.

And to this day, I have a real knee-jerk reaction to being snubbed, treated cattily, or excluded. And, to be honest, I was for a long time very skeptical that most girls/women, are sincerely nice. Even now, I'm wary. I seriously would rather be physically bullied than emotionally bullied, any day.

[vivo]

hmm I got bullied a bit. not quite sure completely why. I did stupid things sometimes in 6th/7th grade. I remember in Hs someone said i was like corky from whatever that show was. with sarah michelle gellar. oh yes, life goes on. i did bully a bit but i don't think anything regular. hmm maybe my lack of social skills too. another unrelated thing is some people thought i was smart but I wasn't up there with the 1300+ honor society 37 or even 3.5+ gpa kids. i did ok. then again i wasn't all theat obsessive about doing well.

i remember i fell out of my chair in 6th grade math for no reason that I can remember. i let someone draw a mustache on me in class and got yelled at. I generally temember being pretty happy in school though.

[vivo]

odd thing was i think i got bullied more and more seriously in middle than elem school.

[wordsmith]

That's actually not odd at all, most bullying goes on in middle school.

[Ciderhillnh]

I was bullied and teased from the age of 5 until I graduated high school. It was severe and cruel.
I was booed off the stage when I went to get my high school diploma.
That’s just one instance, but I think it gives a clear picture of how much I wasn’t liked.

Reasons for why I think I was chosen? Im an only child, and because of this I spoke like an adult and had a hard time speaking to my peers on their level.
I had strict parents and I wasn’t allowed to do much. I also had a very strong sense of self, and never went along with what everyone else was doing just so I could be a part of it. If I liked it sure, if I didn’t I wasn’t about to pretend.

Residual effects? Yes I have many. I tend to worry that Im pissing someone off, Im concerned if they are still my friend, I tweak when a friend doesn’t call back and start to wonder what Ive done wrong.
I go a bit nuts about having plans on the weekends just because I missed out so much growing up.

Positive effects…..Im a very strong person. I actually went to my high school reunion and had people apologizing to me (too little to late) and I flat out said I appreciate your apology but its more for yourself than for me, thanks for making me into the strong person I am.
I have a very thick skin, I stand on my 2 feet and am proud of it. I don’t feel pressure to conform just to conform.

I also used my being bullied to help teach the kids I used to work with about its effects and what they were doing was wrong.
I would be the cool counselor and be friends with all the kids….and would especially try to get on the good side of the popular girls who would bully.
Then Id sit them down and ask them what type of person they think I would have been when I was their age…..they would tell me popular, tons of friends, etc.
Id tell them the real story (illustrated by my yearbook with my geek picture and all the mean things people wrote to me) they would be taken by surprise, and Id tell them how what they were doing to the other girls was horrible.
Most summers, I got the girls to blend, they might not have been best friends, but the popular girls would ask the other girls to hang out and it made for some really neat unexpected friendships, that lasted!
They all learned lessons.

[WorkInProgress]

Yes, and yes. :redface:

I was bullied much worse than I ever did it to someone else, though. (Just one other person.)

It was never an issue for me until I changed schools in the 5th grade, and that, looking back, was pretty run of the mill stuff, but I had other issues at the time and it has definitely made an impact on how I live. At the next school I went to in 5th grade, I definitely bullied the kid who sat next to me. Hopefully I didn't eff him up for life.

7th grade, though, was the worst year ever. I was an easy target and an unhappy kid anyway.

Things were better in 8th grade, and I didn't have any issues with this crap in high school.

[winneythepooh7]

I was bullied and teased from the age of 5 until I graduated high school. It was severe and cruel.
I was booed off the stage when I went to get my high school diploma.
That’s just one instance, but I think it gives a clear picture of how much I wasn’t liked.

Reasons for why I think I was chosen? Im an only child, and because of this I spoke like an adult and had a hard time speaking to my peers on their level.
I had strict parents and I wasn’t allowed to do much. I also had a very strong sense of self, and never went along with what everyone else was doing just so I could be a part of it. If I liked it sure, if I didn’t I wasn’t about to pretend.

Residual effects? Yes I have many. I tend to worry that Im pissing someone off, Im concerned if they are still my friend, I tweak when a friend doesn’t call back and start to wonder what Ive done wrong.
I go a bit nuts about having plans on the weekends just because I missed out so much growing up.

Positive effects…..Im a very strong person. I actually went to my high school reunion and had people apologizing to me (too little to late) and I flat out said I appreciate your apology but its more for yourself than for me, thanks for making me into the strong person I am.
I have a very thick skin, I stand on my 2 feet and am proud of it. I don’t feel pressure to conform just to conform.

I also used my being bullied to help teach the kids I used to work with about its effects and what they were doing was wrong.
I would be the cool counselor and be friends with all the kids….and would especially try to get on the good side of the popular girls who would bully.
Then Id sit them down and ask them what type of person they think I would have been when I was their age…..they would tell me popular, tons of friends, etc.
Id tell them the real story (illustrated by my yearbook with my geek picture and all the mean things people wrote to me) they would be taken by surprise, and Id tell them how what they were doing to the other girls was horrible.
Most summers, I got the girls to blend, they might not have been best friends, but the popular girls would ask the other girls to hang out and it made for some really neat unexpected friendships, that lasted!
They all learned lessons.

Thanks for posting this. I always wondered why you put so much emphasis into what was going on in your weekends, and how many different people you were hanging out with.

[tina1979]

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[Kitty]

I was a bully but never got bullied.

[wordsmith]

The more I think about it, the more it stands out to me that all my closest female friends since I was the age when I got ranked out a lot are very mellow, very passive women (which, believe it or not, is much closer to how I am in real life...nowhere near as outspoken or openly opinionated as I come off on the boards, probably...written communication is far more my strength than verbal). I have pretty much most of my life shied away from strong, dominant, overpowering personality types when it comes to female friends, far preferring low-key, understated types. All of my best friends in high school (post-bullying) were the more passive, timid, quiet types. If I were a psychologist looking at me, I'd say that that may have a lot to do with trusting them more than I do dominant ringleader types. No "queen bees," I didn't, and to an extent, don't, trust them. I never bought into the social heirarchy of high school, I hung out with who I wanted to, which was a really random cross section. The only common denominator was that my friends were all passive, non-confrontational, non-dominant personality types.

I definitely do think that being picked on can make you stronger...and I'm sure that I'm stronger for having had the experience...but it can also serve to make you simply change how you interact and with whom you choose to interact.

[ScottyTheBody]

I never bullied and was never really bullied in school.

In elementary/middle school, I was sort of the guy that everybody liked. I'd become friends with whoever was there and because of this, I actually got a lot of respect. I had friends who were bullies and friends who were bullied.

Then one day, in grade 2, I started to see the effects of this bullying, stuff that I never noticed before. So basically I started to stand up for the victims, a little (just telling the bullies to be quiet, etc). Then one day, my best friend, who was basically bullied a lot, was really hurt by this bullying and then I stood up to the bullies, who were also my friends. I basically gave an ultimatim, for them to stop bullying or I'll destroy them (not physically) but on a social and emotional level (though not said like that at the time because it would have no effect but something to that effect). I think I said something like "you will lose myself as a friend and you will lose every single person on this playground as a friend, nobody will talk to you and you will basically cease to exist as a person at this school". I didn't say it exactly like that, because my vocabulary wasn't as good but something to that effect that got that my point across. At first he didn't believe me, but after a solid week of exclusion, he not only apologized to me, he apologized to my best friend.

I also never allowed someone in my group of friends to exclude anyone (no matter who they were) and basically if they excluded someone, I'd follow that someone. I told them, if they exclude someone than they exclude me. This type of reaction actually had a very positive effect and decreased the amount of bullying and exclusion that went on at the school (which was very small) at that time.

It's unfortunate though that the victim cannot perform these types of actions to eliminate bullying. Also, it is unfortunate too, that most bullies don't realize what they're doing/did and are only doing what feels good and its not until they are bullied themselves do they realize the impact of their actions. I'm not quite sure what I would have done if I was the one being bullied, especially if no one would stand up for me, which is exactly why I stood up for those people being bullied.

However, when I reached high school and even though I wasn't being bullied, I had many friends who were. I had friends that were bullied to the point of having negative social effects and did do the "trenchcoat mafia" look. My teachers (yes, even teachers) and friends would ask why I hung out with these "social outcasts" because many of them saw me as different, a model straight A student (where they were failing most of their classes) and the furthest thing from a "trenchcoat mafia". They always said "you're friends are going to have a negative impact on you" and "people always say your friends are a reflection of you' but they never understood that maybe I was having a positive effect on them, maybe I was giving them hope, showing them that there are decent people out there who do give a damn about them. These "trenchcoat mafia" friends may not have had a lot in common with myself but I still stood up for them against teachers and students when they needed me.

Unfortunately, I didn't have enough of an impact in high school. I had lost almost all of the "power" I had in elementary school, since the school was so large and I couldn't squash the bullying like I had before.

By the way, these bullies were extremely cold-hearted. They had bullied a boy at our school for many years (which I still regret not being able to stop, though I was not particularly close to) until he committed suicide. The worst part is, when he committed suicide, the bullies didn't even feel bad and they showed up to his funeral, cracking jokes and they also applauded when his family closed the coffin.

I may not have been bullied but I know about the very negative effects that it can have.

[Winter Storm]

I wasn't so much bullied as I was picked on and teased in middle school. I was voted one of the ugliest girls in class and the older kids made fun of my clothes, my hair, my glasses and overpowered me because of my naturally shy/quiet demeanor.

It probably hasn't had a long-term serious effect but there are still times when I feel like that painfully shy, ugly kid that no one can stand.

[WorkInProgress]

My brother was badly, badly bullied for a lot of his school life. And his schools didn't do crap about it. There were meetings, etc. but nothing ever changed or stopped.

[Kitty]

My brother was badly, badly bullied for a lot of his school life. And his schools didn't do crap about it. There were meetings, etc. but nothing ever changed or stopped.

Yeah..that's rough. I think a lot of kids don't even say anything..they're affraid it will make things worse.

[wordsmith]

My teachers (yes, even teachers) and friends would ask why I hung out with these "social outcasts" because many of them saw me as different, a model straight A student (where they were failing most of their classes) and the furthest thing from a "trenchcoat mafia". They always said "you're friends are going to have a negative impact on you" and "people always say your friends are a reflection of you' but they never understood that maybe I was having a positive effect on them, maybe I was giving them hope, showing them that there are decent people out there who do give a damn about them. These "trenchcoat mafia" friends may not have had a lot in common with myself but I still stood up for them against teachers and students when they needed me.


A lot of my friends were otherwise social outcasts - I had a lot of friends who could probably say that I was their only friend, and for sure, a lot of teachers took issue with some of my friends as "negative influences" and "bringing you down." My parents were always proud of me, though, for not shunning anybody, and I know that they had calls from those friends' parents, talking about my good influence on their kids (by virtue of being a good student, pretty well-adjusted, involved, and really never in any kind of trouble).

But it's also true that a large part of my giving loner kids who didn't have a lot of friends a chance is because all it takes to become REALLY distrustful of groups, packs, cliques is to be picked on by one of those groups...I trusted kids who were loners WAY more than I did ones who moved in a herd. I still don't prefer large groups. I'm very distrustful of the pack mentality. Even at the adult level, a pack will turn on individual members.

[tina1979]

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[wordsmith]

I wasn't so much bullied as I was picked on and teased in middle school. I was voted one of the ugliest girls in class and the older kids made fun of my clothes, my hair, my glasses and overpowered me because of my naturally shy/quiet demeanor.

This is definitely bullying.

[LakeJay]

I didn't get bullied growing up and for the most part I don't think I bullied anyone. I did hear racial remarks every once in a while which did make me feel confused and helpless at the time. Those remarks still stick with me in that it makes me aware that some people just can't look past the "differences" that are associated to my ethnicity.

[wordsmith]

My brother was badly, badly bullied for a lot of his school life. And his schools didn't do crap about it. There were meetings, etc. but nothing ever changed or stopped.

I have twin brothers...one who was an alpha type, outgoing, and ultra popular, and one who was quiet, unassuming, and therefore a target for bullies for a good stretch (until he became an athletic breakout star toward the end of high school, anyway, then he was suddenly cool). But because nobody wanted to piss off his twin, who wielded a lot of social clout, it only went so far.

[WorkInProgress]

My cousin went through this. It was so bad he ended up with a couple of broken bones. His parents eventually pulled him out of the school and sent him to private school although they really couldn't afford it.

As far as I know, he was never actually hit. But he seems to have gotten all the shitty kids who figured out that emotional abuse doesn't leave a visible mark and hurts worse. My experiences with bullying pale in comparison to his.

[wordsmith]

The thing is that it's VERY, VERY, VERY difficult to combat bullying as an adult supervisor or teacher, having been in both positions.

The most you can do is obviously forbid physical bullying, dissuade it with the threat of punishment (which often just serves to make the non-physical bullying worse, anyway). You can also forbid the most overt kind of emotional bullying, in terms of not allowing kids to cut somebody from the herd, be overtly cruel, etc. if you observe it going on, and call the perpetrators out. If it's a setting other than school, you can ban kids who offend in this way from participation, but that carries it's own repercussions, as well.

The bottom line is, you can't make kids be nice to or like one another, no matter what you do. You can demand a certain level of behavior at most. But you can't force anybody to accept and respect anybody else if they don't want to. They might go through the motions, at the very most.

And if their bullying attributes are learned and reinforced by environmental factors, say, at home, you're fighting a losing battle anyway. You can't cure a bully who's the product of bullies.

[cache]

I was never bullied, nor did I bully. I think that isolated me from knowledge about it. I didn't really realize stuff like this happened, I thought everyone was friends with everyone else, like I was.

[WorkInProgress]

The thing is that it's VERY, VERY, VERY difficult to combat bullying as an adult supervisor or teacher, having been in both positions.

The most you can do is obviously forbid physical bullying, dissuade it with the threat of punishment (which often just serves to make the non-physical bullying worse, anyway). You can also forbid the most overt kind of emotional bullying, in terms of not allowing kids to cut somebody from the herd, be overtly cruel, etc. if you observe it going on, and call the perpetrators out. If it's a setting other than school, you can ban kids who offend in this way from participation, but that carries it's own repercussions, as well.

The bottom line is, you can't make kids be nice to or like one another, no matter what you do. You can demand a certain level of behavior at most. But you can't force anybody to accept and respect anybody else if they don't want to. They might go through the motions, at the very most.

And if their bullying attributes are learned and reinforced by environmental factors, say, at home, you're fighting a losing battle anyway. You can't cure a bully who's the product of bullies.

That's true. One kid (whose name I remember :eek: ) and his parents were such a pain in the ass. Of course their kid would never do something like that, and clearly my brother was just making shit up because a)he didn't like their kid or b)because my brother was racist. That, as far as I recall, was about the whole conversation. Like I said, nothing changed. And yeah, it definitely does start and gets reinforced in the home.

[winneythepooh7]

I still to this day remember throughout school kids being seperated by the "high class" and the "low class", which translates to the smart kids vs. the dumb kids. Everyone who was in the "high classes" would rather be dead then associate with any of the kids in the "low classes". It was such a shitty system that really labeled people, even to this day. I wasn't in all of the "high classes" but for the most part, was in with all the regular, average kids, the kids who were perceived as "normal" as opposed to those who were perceived as being losers because of their grades or learning difficulties.

[wordsmith]

That's true. One kid (whose name I remember :eek: ) and his parents were such a pain in the ass. Of course their kid would never do something like that, and clearly my brother was just making shit up because a)he didn't like their kid or b)because my brother was racist. That, as far as I recall, was about the whole conversation. Like I said, nothing changed. And yeah, it definitely does start and gets reinforced in the home.

Of the girl group that ostracized me when I was in middle school, my mom evidently appealed to some of their their moms on a "we're both moms of girls, can't this stop" kind of level, and it being a small town, these were people you knew, went to church with, did PTA stuff with, sat at Little League games with, saw in the grocery store, etc., not strangers.

Two of them told my mom off and said that THEY'D fight her, and one was highly offended that it would even be suggested that her kid would do such a thing, and that the problem was obviously that my mom was jealous of her daughter's popularity.

Years later, that last mom called my mother (who had gone on to do youth work, PTA stuff, sponsoring dances, etc.), to ask her if she'd take her younger daughter under her wing at a dance, and keep an eye out, because a group of girls was bullying her. She at least had the good graces to say, "I can't believe I'm asking you to do this, and I wouldn't blame you if you hung up on me." So what goes around DOES come around.

[wordsmith]

I still to this day remember throughout school kids being seperated by the "high class" and the "low class", which translates to the smart kids vs. the dumb kids. Everyone who was in the "high classes" would rather be dead then associate with any of the kids in the "low classes". It was such a shitty system that really labeled people, even to this day. I wasn't in all of the "high classes" but for the most part, was in with all the regular, average kids, the kids who were perceived as "normal" as opposed to those who were perceived as being losers because of their grades or learning difficulties.

In my case, it was actually the reverse. The "smart," i.e. higher tracked kids, got picked on the worst. But I'm from a pretty blue collar town, where there's a big chip-on-your-shoulder mentality about being a high academic achiever, and most of the popular kids were not the kids in the higher track classes. If you were a kid in an accelerated class, you got needled for thinking you were smarter, being a nerd, whatever.

[Ciderhillnh]

I tried everything to get people to stop bullying me….I ignored them…they kept at it….I talked back…they kept at it.
Told the school counselor….made it MUCH MUCH worse….
My parents once had to call a kids parents because he pushed me down and I broke my finger (he actually pushed me down while I was on crutches from breaking my foot….great kid)
His mother actually said NOT MY SON…….that was always my favorite. The parents would be approached that their child was being a bully and NOT MY CHILD was always the answer.
The best was when teachers would believe the bully over me……I never did anything to get in trouble, had good grades, was respectful and I would still be blamed for antagonizing the bully and MAKING them bully me…uhm NO.

I didn’t have anyone sticking up for me. Talking to me was comitting social leprocy. So no one had my back but me.

But I went to school dances alone, I spent weekends home doing nothing, never really talked on the phone with anyone….surprisingly though…..I did have boyfriends (starting in 8th grade) nothing really lasted long….maybe a couple weeks…

But I dated people in grades above…and my first long term BF didn’t care about the teasing I endured, he just rose above it.

I think that since I spend so much time alone, I figured out who I was really really young…which translated into college, so I never did the drinking party thing….didnt need to. I knew who I was and didn’t have to try all that stuff out to see where I fit.

Though I wish I could have shed so much of my insecurity but it went with me and I was so afraid people wouldn’t like me so I didn’t even try to create friendships.

That’s probably why now Im so outgoing and talk to anyone and always want to make new friends. Even though I missed out on many of those skills growing up, I obviously learned something as making friends now is easy for me.

[WorkInProgress]

Of the girl group that ostracized me when I was in middle school, my mom evidently appealed to some of their their moms on a "we're both moms of girls, can't this stop" kind of level, and it being a small town, these were people you knew, went to church with, did PTA stuff with, sat at Little League games with, saw in the grocery store, etc., not strangers.

Two of them told my mom off and said that THEY'D fight her, and one was highly offended that it would even be suggested that her kid would do such a thing, and that the problem was obviously that my mom was jealous of her daughter's popularity.

Years later, that last mom called my mother (who had gone on to do youth work, PTA stuff, sponsoring dances, etc.), to ask her if she'd take her younger daughter under her wing at a dance, and keep an eye out, because a group of girls was bullying her. She at least had the good graces to say, "I can't believe I'm asking you to do this, and I wouldn't blame you if you hung up on me." So what goes around DOES come around.

People suck.

[WorkInProgress]

In my case, it was actually the reverse. The "smart," i.e. higher tracked kids, got picked on the worst. But I'm from a pretty blue collar town, where there's a big chip-on-your-shoulder mentality about being a high academic achiever, and most of the popular kids were not the kids in the higher track classes. If you were a kid in an accelerated class, you got needled for thinking you were smarter, being a nerd, whatever.

Nobody ever picked on me about being smart, etc., but I'm sure that was one of the reasons I was targeted. Standing out is not something that middle schoolers really appreciate.

[wordsmith]

Actually, oddly enough, a big part of my getting picked on had to do with how cool my parents actually were, ironically enough.

Most of the girls who picked on me came from pretty severely broken homes. My mom, by contrast, was the PTA mom extraordinaire, super involved, the mom everybody loved, the mom who had 15 million "children" because all my friends, all my brothers' friends, kids I didn't even socialize with, etc. all called her "Mama J." To a group of girls who either didn't have moms in the picture, had pretty skanky moms, or moms who really didn't have much to do with participating in their lives, it must have been an issue that I had a mom who was like supermom, and mega involved in school stuff. She did things like organize all the school dances, which we otherwise wouldn't have had, etc.

Bullies will always look for reasons to target you, but jealousy over this factor def. played a role, when I look back at it.

[DontHate]

I was "bullied" and was a "bully". Although, in my schools everyone kinda teased everyone else. It wasn't a huge deal. There are only a few select classmates I can think of that were seriously bullied. One of these classmates fell down a flight of stairs or something like that and died my junior year of H.S. I thought it was hypocritical because a bunch of students held this big "celebration of life" event after school to say goodbye to her. Um...you all treated her like crap when she was alive. You were not her friends. Why are you pretending to care about her now? I actually remember one student saying this aloud after the announcement was made that she died. Everyone jumped on him, calling him insenstive but he was right. If you didn't like her then, why are you pretending to be so broken up now. Maybe you should have just treated her better when she was around. :rolleyes:

Anyways, I don't see being called dirty names as being bullied. That would be teasing. Bullying to me is using intimidation or force to get something from your victim. More like "give me your lunch money or I'll beat you up" rather than "you're an ugly foureyes." Both are equally bad.

[wordsmith]

Bullying is far more than physical violence. Girls comparatively rarely physically bully one another. Does this mean that bullying doesn't go on among girls? That you're not singled out, victimized, or intimidated if you're not pushed down stairs or threatened with bodily harm? Hardly. This one's gonna go to semantics.

[WorkInProgress]

Anyways, I don't see being called dirty names as being bullied. That would be teasing. Bullying to me is using intimidation or force to get something from your victim. More like "give me your lunch money or I'll beat you up" rather than "you're an ugly foureyes." Both are equally bad.

I disagree, but that is a vocabulary issue.

[WorkInProgress]

Cross post, words. Shocker.

[ScottyTheBody]

My brother recently told me he was bullied when he was in elementary school, like in grade 1 or 2, but gradually got them to stop by making them laugh. My brother is a naturally funny guy and he'd just start making fart jokes when the bully would start to beat him up and the bully would gradually hit softer and softer until finally he'd stop because he'd be laughing so hard. Nobody even knew he was being bullied.

Also, my sister was bullied in middle school. She had "friends" who would one minute be her best friend and then the next be making fun of her constantly (saying "we're just joking"). She'd come home crying one day and on top of the world the next. Thankfully this stopped when she entered high school and stopped trying to be "popular".

[DontHate]

Bullying is far more than physical violence. Girls comparatively rarely physically bully one another. Does this mean that bullying doesn't go on among girls? That you're not singled out, victimized, or intimidated if you're not pushed down stairs or threatened with bodily harm? Hardly. This one's gonna go to semantics.Let me clarify -- I believe bullying is intimidation, force, manipulation etc etc used in order to get something from the victim. This doesn't only mean "give me your lunch money or I'll beat you up." I was just using that as an example. This could be a group of girls threatening to spread rumors about a peer unless she stops going after the guy one of them wants to date, or a husband manipulating his wife so that she'll let him play golf instead of mowing the lawn. Now, it can mean verbal abuse, but if the abuser is not abusing in order to gain something, I don't define it as bullying.

[Trillian42]

I don't know if I would say I was outright bullied, but I was one of the targets of the class clowns in middle school. They would get a laugh by making fun of me and my friends. I think my friends got bullied alot more than I did. We were the "oddballs" mostly nerdy kids.

It all stopped (for me anyway, they continued to tease my friends when I wasn't around) when I finally couldn't take it any more and stood up to one of them one day in 8th grade. She had thrown a snowball at my best friend and I in the middle of science class. I stood up and started telling her that she really pissed me off and I wasn't going to take it anymore. I think I was maybe prepared to get in a fist fight with her (I've never hit anyone in my life, but I don't remember ever feeling so angry) but she backed down and tried to laugh it off.

She later wrote me note saying she was sorry and never realized how much her teasing hurt me because I never reacted before. It wasn't until high school that I realized how hard a life she had, that she'd been homeless since she was 14 and had to work all through high school just to be able to afford to eat. I sometimes wish we could have been better friends.

[WorkInProgress]

Let me clarify -- I believe bullying is intimidation, force, manipulation etc etc used in order to get something from the victim. This doesn't only mean "give me your lunch money or I'll beat you up." I was just using that as an example. This could be a group of girls threatening to spread rumors about a peer unless she stops going after the guy one of them wants to date, or a husband manipulating his wife so that she'll let him play golf instead of mowing the lawn. Now, it can mean verbal abuse, but if the abuser is not abusing in order to gain something, I don't define it as bullying.

You are entitled to your opinion on this.

See, I think that the reaction is what the bully is looking for. Or the satisfaction of feeling better about him-/herself. I think that is something that the bully (IMO) or teaser (in yours, it seems) gets out of it.

In the end, like I already said, potayto, potahto. I think it's a negligible and purposeless distincion.

[wordsmith]

Yup, I don't see a distinction, either, in bullying, teasing, ostracizing, cutting from the herd, isolating through ridicule, what have you.

Bottom line is that it's a power play in which the stronger (usually by virtue of numbers for girls, by virtue of physical imposition for boys) exerts power over the weaker.

Also, by DontHate's definition, it's only bullying if you're trying to get something out of it, and I would argue that in all these situations, the perpetrator is trying to get something out of it. If it's the teasing variety, it's done to try to gain social status by being at the top of the pecking order, it's done, like WIP said, to get a reaction for entertaiment value, etc.

[Trillian42]

I was a bully but never got bullied.

Thanks for being honest, Kitty. I'm curious, if you had a kid who was being bullied or being a bully, what would you tell them?

[WorkInProgress]

Courtesy of dictionary.com, bully: a blustering, quarrelsome, overbearing person who habitually badgers and intimidates smaller or weaker people.

[wordsmith]

Nobody ever picked on me about being smart, etc., but I'm sure that was one of the reasons I was targeted. Standing out is not something that middle schoolers really appreciate.

The interesting thing for me is that, from years of working with middle schoolers and volunteering with them as a teen and adult myself, I've observed quite a bit...social acceptance and assimilation is more key at that developmental stage moreso than at any other, so, no, standing out is, MOST of the time, the last thing that anybody wants. But occasionally, you DO get the odd kid (often one who's matured beyond that particular developmental stage, that one kid in how ever many who's a little past where the other kids are in the actual maturity process, maybe an early bloomer) who DOESN'T seem to care about assimilating/fitting in. It's pretty rare, but it does happen. And I've witnessed it going two totally opposite directions. Sometimes, the kid is celebrated by his or her peers and is super popular for it and seen as a leader, other times, the kid is shunned as an oddball outcast for being the same way. It seems to depend on personality type, and that elusive thing called charisma, as to which way it will go.

[DontHate]

Courtesy of dictionary.com, bully: a blustering, quarrelsome, overbearing person who habitually badgers and intimidates smaller or weaker people.
I was a "bully" but I was never blustering, quarrelsome or overbearing. I was quiet, sneaky and manipulative. And the person I "bullied" was niether smaller nor weaker (overtime of course I was able to break this person down).

Anyways, like I said, that's how I define it. I'm not asking anyone to agree. Bullying, teasing it's all bad and shouldn't be tolerated.

[and1grad]

I cant say I was ever "bullied" nor was I ever a bully. I dont think I was ever so insecure that I needed to pick on someone to make myself feel better. I faced my share of teasing but I dont think it was any more than anyone else. I kind of think of it as a rite of passage. You're GONNA get teased...what are you gonna do about it? Dont get me wrong, it does often go too far tho.

[wordsmith]

There's a definite threshold between occasionally getting teased and long-term targeting by the same person or group of people.

In my first post on the thread, I noted how when I got the routine bus bullying, it wasn't a big deal, b/c it happened to everybody, it wasn't really being singled out, you just happened to be the one who got it that day. That's not sombody targeting you specifically.

But when the same group of people picks on you for three years running? That's not the same at all as random people ribbing you once in a while.

[WorkInProgress]

There's a definite threshold between occasionally getting teased and long-term targeting by the same person or group of people.

In my first post on the thread, I noted how when I got the routine bus bullying, it wasn't a big deal, b/c it happened to everybody, it wasn't really being singled out, you just happened to be the one who got it that day. That's not sombody targeting you specifically.

But when the same group of people picks on you for three years running? That's not the same at all as random people ribbing you once in a while.

Exactly. A little ribbing (even if it is intended to be hurtful) is one thing. Doggedly targeting a person daily over an extended period of time is not. And neither should be acceptable behavior. Understandable, yes. Expected, yes. Acceptable, no.

[wordsmith]

Kids should never have to dread going to school due to treatment at the hands of fellow classmates. All I'm saying. You're right, that should NOT be acceptable.

[Brillo25]

I was definitely bullied, and seventh grade was especially the worst after we moved to a new town at the height of my awkward stage. I was shunned from the get-go, many of my recesses were spent with eighth-graders encircling me and take turns ripping on me. The popular thing was to ask me if I was "a boy or a girl," because at 12 I did kinda look like an 8-year-old girl. Physical beatings would have been much better than that kind of verbal abuse. I couldn't open my mouth and draw attention to myself without being berated. I had no friends for a long time. Went home and cried virtually every day.

It's hard to say what the long-term effects were, because I think I'm kind of quiet and shy by nature. But I was reasonably outgoing up until that point, but after that I pretty much hid from my peers for the rest of middle school and high school. Did my best to sit in the corner and make myself invisible. And with staying around the same town, there were too many elements around to remind of those days to where I still felt like that persecuted, unwanted kid until I kind of started a new life for myself in my mid-20s. Until then I never dated, never tried meeting new people, etc.

[Winter Storm]

I was definitely bullied, and seventh grade was especially the worst after we moved to a new town at the height of my awkward stage. I was shunned from the get-go, many of my recesses were spent with eighth-graders encircling me and take turns ripping on me. The popular thing was to ask me if I was "a boy or a girl," because at 12 I did kinda look like an 8-year-old girl. Physical beatings would have been much better than that kind of verbal abuse. I couldn't open my mouth and draw attention to myself without being berated. I had no friends for a long time. Went home and cried virtually every day.


Yes, middle school was the worse. I was a sixth grader being picked on by eighth graders.

[wordsmith]

Awww, Brill...you can at least take solace in the fact that the big blues might not have been an asset then, but they are now. :)

I remember WANTING to go home and cry when I got picked on...sometimes I did because I just couldn't help it, but I remember even MORE desperately not wanting my parents to know that it really hurt my feelings that badly. I wanted them to think that I was strong enough to brush it off.

Come to think of it, I spent a LOT of my life swallowing hurt feelings out of pride and keeping my chin up and pretending that snubs and stuff didn't bother me, even when it was past that brief interlude of outright cruelty. I don't do that anymore. I don't know when, but at some point in recent years, it clicked with me that being hurt isn't something I have to hide, that it doesn't make me a less strong person to admit that something hurt me, and that people OUGHT to be told when they hurt you. That is a HUGE turnaround for me, when for years I just swallowed it.

[WorkInProgress]

I remember WANTING to go home and cry when I got picked on...sometimes I did because I just couldn't help it, but I remember even MORE desperately not wanting my parents to know that it really hurt my feelings that badly. I wanted them to think that I was strong enough to brush it off.

I don't think I ever told my parents. But I'm a very private person, emotionally, and don't like people to know when I'm upset. This is both good and bad.

[Winter Storm]

I don't think I ever told my parents. But I'm a very private person, emotionally, and don't like people to know when I'm upset. This is both good and bad.

I told my parents, they shrugged it off and said life isn't fair sometimes.

[tina1979]

[deleted

[Brillo25]

Awww, Brill...you can at least take solace in the fact that the big blues might not have been an asset then, but they are now. :)


Haha, thanks. *blushes*. Enough has happened in the last five years to change things a lot, but really during that time in and just after college when my small group of friends were still friends from high school, and often there were other people from high school who showed up who I had less than warm feelings for, not a lot changed for me psychologically during those years. Not until I separated myself from that scene for a while.

[wordsmith]

I subscribe to the never let 'em see you sweat philosophy...

If I'm being treated poorly by somebody who's a random asshole, I NEVER want them to see that they've gotten to me.

But if it's somebody who is supposedly close to me, and they're treating me poorly, or behaving hurtfully, I for sure let them know. There's no point in telling a bully who doesn't give a rat's ass about you, "You know, that realy hurt my feelings...that wasn't nice," obviously. But if it's somebody who SHOULD care that what they did hurt, they're totally getting called on it.

[grneyedmustang]

With me, it goes both ways. I remember being bullied, as well as picking on others :redface: (I'm quite ashamed of picking on others now).

Middle school was the worst. I was one of the tallest girls in the school, and not skinny by any means (I wasn't a double wide -- but not a little girl, either). I was always in accelerated classes and on the honor roll, so I instantly earned the title "nerd" from that alone. Then, there was this one clique of guys that were considered the "popular" guys -- and I had a huge crush on one of the guys. He was in a few of my classes, so although he was popular, he was also smart (but would never admit it). One day we were all at PE, and sitting down waiting to be sectioned off for square dancing. One of the guys in the group called me fat and ugly -- and the guy I had the crush on laughed for like 15 minutes. After that, I sat on the sidelines and pretended to be asleep, so that I could cry. There were other times where I was called other/similar names, also -- both by them and by others -- but I remember that incident like it was yesterday.

Almost all of them graduated and didn't do shit with their lives. I saw 4 of them after I went off to college - and did not speak. They went and told my best friend that I saw them in the mall and acted like I was too good to speak to them. Whatever. I guess there are residual effects, because I wouldn't piss on any of these guys now if they were on fire. Am I still angry? Yes, definitely. I wouldn't take them onto Maury or anything (but I've thought about it once or twice, LOL). It did take a toll on my self esteem, this is one of the issues I'm still dealing with today. I told my parents about it once or twice, and they just kinda shrugged it off. I guess that's the point in my life where I stopped telling people about how I really feel sometimes, because I think I'm bothering people or they don't want to hear what I have to say. A few people have told me recently that I hide and mask my real feelings.

I also remember being in class, and picking on one or two guys that were farther down the nerd ladder than I was. Well, I guess it wasn't outright picking on them, but someone else would say something mean, and I wouldn't hide my laughter or stick up for them. Regardless, it wasn't right...and I feel bad about it now.

[LaFille]

Let me clarify -- I believe bullying is intimidation, force, manipulation etc etc used in order to get something from the victim. This doesn't only mean "give me your lunch money or I'll beat you up." I was just using that as an example. This could be a group of girls threatening to spread rumors about a peer unless she stops going after the guy one of them wants to date, or a husband manipulating his wife so that she'll let him play golf instead of mowing the lawn. Now, it can mean verbal abuse, but if the abuser is not abusing in order to gain something, I don't define it as bullying.
what about kids who get picked on for no reason at all? i think kids who are bullies do it more for the power of being able to manipulate someone. i'm certainly not comparing the gravity of the crime to a rape, but they always say that rapes have more to do with power than with sex.

i never was a bully and i never recall personally having trouble with them either. i hated being around that though. kids can be awful.

[wordsmith]

what about kids who get picked on for no reason at all? i think kids who are bullies do it more for the power of being able to manipulate someone. i'm certainly not comparing the gravity of the crime to a rape, but they always say that rapes have more to do with power than with sex.


Yup, you're still getting something...be it social power, recognition from your peers...there IS a reason.

There are kids who do spur bullies on (I had a friend who was one of them, she would taunt a group of girls and egg them on, and then get her butt summarily kicked). But there are also kids who mind their own business and are targeted by bullies...who don't do anything, and are targeted for no reason at all other than their relative weakness.