"when kids and teachers don't click"

[weary]

i wasn't really sure where to put this, but i'd like to hear what the teachers on here have to say. (parents too...althought i don't know if there are nearly as many as teachers.)

article from MSN:


When Kids and Teachers Don't Click
Are your child and his teacher at odds? Take these steps to foster a better relationship.
Myrna B. Shure Ph.D

If you worry that your child's teacher doesn't like him, first try to explore what's triggering these fears. Has your child been saying that his teacher doesn't like him, doesn't pay attention to him, or speaks harshly to him? Or have you noticed something -- perhaps that the teacher only shares negative comments with you about your son's behavior, attitude, or schoolwork?

Whether your child complains, you have received negative feedback directly, or your just have a gut feeling that something isn't right, the first step is to set up a conference with the teacher. To avoid putting her on the defensive, ask objective questions, such as:

I've noticed that my son seems to be having difficulty at school. Can you tell me how it's been going?
Is he behaving in ways that are annoying or disruptive?
Is there anything you'd like to see change?

You want to send the message that you care very much about how your child does in school, and that you are there to help. You can ask the teacher, "How can we work together to help him do well and get along with others?" If you are genuinely interested, most teachers will take a new, active interest in your child.

For older children, if you learn that your child's behavior is the problem, you can help him appreciate that some of what he does is bothersome and offer suggestions for how he might change that. If his teacher doesn't reveal helpful information, involve him in figuring out what to do next. By working with the teacher and, if needed, with your child, you will be able to solve the problem.

[Krishna]

I'd say there are definately times when teachers and students dont click. The overwhelming sentiment is that teachers aren't supposed to play favorites, and are supposed to like/get along with all their students equally. The reality is though that there is at least one kid each year who makes a teacher want to down a bottle of booze every night. Whether it's because the kid is a bully to fellow students, or whether the kid generally disruptive in class, sometimes ya just dont get along with everyone. Sometimes students overreact about teachers' actions too. Suzie might come home and say "Ms Krishna doesnt like me, so she gave me detention" without mentioning that she (Suzie) had precipitated the detention by failing to complete her umpteenth assignment and/or by b*#@! slapping the girl next to her.

I strongly agree with setting up a conference with the teacher- set aside some time to talk first with the teacher alone, then with the teacher and your child. Frankly, as we all have learned, there are at least 2 sides to every story. Marching in and demanding to know why we dislike Suzie or Jonny while standing over us imposingly will just lead us to call in the cavalry (ie the nearest teacher/Principal).:p

[Kitty]

I used to share a cube with an ex elementary school teacher and she said her biggest problem was when the parents would side with the kid and generally act as though the teacher wasn't the authority and didn't know anything. A lot of parents won't back the teacher and if the kid sees that or is aware of that, it spells disaster. It's kind of like if you do something wrong and your parents don't agree on your punishment - not good. Parents need to have a strong solid front that shows they're in agreement about the punishment, situation, etc.

[WorkInProgress]

I used to share a cube with an ex elementary school teacher and she said her biggest problem was when the parents would side with the kid and generally act as though the teacher wasn't the authority and didn't know anything. A lot of parents won't back the teacher and if the kid sees that or is aware of that, it spells disaster. It's kind of like if you do something wrong and your parents don't agree on your punishment - not good. Parents need to have a strong solid front that shows they're in agreement about the punishment, situation, etc.

Yep. It's like that with other organizations that deal with kids too (summer camp, cub scouts, etc.). I hate it when some parents say, "Not MY Johnny..." Yes, sometimes YOUR Johnny is the problem. Not always, and parents do need to be advocates for their kids, but, damn.

[dengeist]

I like the article because it gives advice on how to deal with it in an adult way. Honestly some kids are little shits and their parents know it. The parents that usually jump in your face are the parents of....you guessed it! They say the apple doesn't fall too far from the tree.

Kids have a way of exaggerating situations. Somewhere along the line some parents forgot that many children exaggerate and misinterpret what is said to them. I could say, "Jimmy that was an unwise decision not to do your work, you're going to do it for lunch detention today." Some kids will turn it around and tell their parents, "Mom, Mr. D said I was stupid and I had lunch detention for no reason! I hate my school!"

I had this one happen to me this year. (This is from a parent that comes in and cleans out her daughter's desk weekly) "I want to know what you're teaching Denisha in writing, because when she comes home and does homework, she misspells things and it's all wrong! I noticed you write comments on her writing and circle her spelling mistakes. I don't see any gains at home." I explained to her that writing was a process and her next step would be to correct her errors and clairfy her meaning. She went on and on about how, she didn't understand how I gave her daughter a 4 (the equivalent of a B) in writing and spelling when she makes mistakes like that. So I said, "I don't allow her to make mistakes like that in class and some children will go home and do anything because no one is monitoring their work. I'll send you some work that she does in class so you can compare."

I started sending the work home with the 90's in spelling and the essays without mistakes and the phone calls stopped.:evil:

[yankeeyosh]

Yep. It's like that with other organizations that deal with kids too (summer camp, cub scouts, etc.). I hate it when some parents say, "Not MY Johnny..." Yes, sometimes YOUR Johnny is the problem. Not always, and parents do need to be advocates for their kids, but, damn.

Yes. Boom and even Gen 'X' parents consistently take the side of their "precious" Johnnie Harvard or Ellie Yale...perfect in every way. I think that this is creating a society of rising adults that feels they are faultless, and this could have dire consequences as they play a more active role in the "real world".

[wordsmith]

When I was a youth worker, I had kids who were behavior problems. And because I wasn't running a school/classroom (although I'm trained as a teacher and no how to deal with kids who have behavioral issues), I didn't have to just put up with it, I could send them home and ask them not to come back if they were repeatedly out of line. Of course, I didn't ever WANT to do that, because to be honest, I was a youth outreach worker with at-risk kids in the inner city, and was trying to provide a haven for kids who have it pretty tough/up against some shitty situations. The last thing you want to do is kick kids out, DIScourage them from the positive activities we were doing. However, I had a few kids who were making things unpleasant for all the other kids, and I'd have to tell them from time to time they weren't welcome to participate unless we could talk about ways to act more appropriately. The parents weren't happy with me for that, because they were counting on the free babysitting. :rolleyes:

[shimma]

I really feel like that article hinted that it's nearly always the kid's fault if s/he has a problem at school.

Due to unavoidable dynamics (it's my parent's job to "ruin people's lives", being a "visible" family lliving in the same town they practiced in, etc) that were not my fault, I had quite a few teachers I didn't "click" with, and the situation was so bad that I ended up being forced to change schools.

My dad represented the ex-husband of my 5th grade teacher in their divorce, and because of things she'd done in her marriage, didn't get the custody, house, alimony, etc she wanted. She took it out on me, bullied me constantly, screaming the cruelest insults at me (Your mother doesn't love you! You're crazy, you had to go see a shrink when your brother died!!) in front of the whole class till I bawled, told other kids not to play with me, and generally made my life an absolute living hell for the entire year, a few years later when some idiot had the bad sense to put me in her class.

The bitch spread the story to the teachers at the feeder junior high that I was "a bad seed", and I already had three strikes against me walking in the door of 6th grade (new school, same system). None of the teachers nor the administration were willing to give me a chance, having heard "only two people in Mrs. Campbell's class will even talk to Shimma", "Shimma's emotionally disturbed and cries in class every day", "she's a little rich bitch whose dad makes 10x what we do (grew up in a bluecollar town)" etc, and were exceedingly nasty to me from the get-go. Best story ever, the principal pulled me aside one day in gym and told me that nobody liked me because I was ugly. (to those who've met me: I looked just like me now, but smaller/younger/thinner)

The really sad thing was, most of the other kids at that school liked me just fine, have gone out of their way to stay in touch thru the years, (and the school I ended up in, wasn't as good a fit for me, was a longer ride away, and was much stricter, but at least everyone left me alone) but when you're constantly being bullied by your teachers, school is torture.

And for the record, I'm a chronic overacheiver, not some delinquent.

Bottom line, not all kids are misbehavers, and not all teachers are long-suffering saints.

[wordsmith]

Children, however, due to their age and maturity levels, are far more likely to behave inappropriately than adult teachers trained to work with children. Children, even "good" children, also don't always possess the maturity to tell the whole version of a story, and parents need to keep that in mind.

All teachers AREN'T saints, but you don't have to be a saint to do your job properly, either. And just because you don't cotton to a kid you must work with, you're not automatically a bad person, and it doesn't translate to treating them unfairly (just like if you're a kid and don't like a teacher, that doesn't mean that you'll act up in their class. I had teachers I didn't like, but I wasn't a behavior problem, ever). Do teachers abuse their authority? Sure. But the vast majority of times when there is a conflict between students and teachers, whose behavior do you really think is likely to be at the root?

For the record, my brother was targeted and bullied by several teachers due to an undiagnosed learning disability, when he was labeled a lazy screwup. So I'm not stranger to teachers being unfair/inappropriate.

[yankeeyosh]

I don't know if you can say if I was "bullied" and "abused" by teachers (students are a different story), but I had many teachers who did not like me...mostly due to my immaturity. A few of them lost their temper at me, and given how behind the curve I was in retrospect, I don't blame them.

The teacher who probably "bullied" me the most was probably my first grade teacher. She really had it in with me...consistently giving me 'N' and 'U' for behavior. One time, I told her that my parents bought ceiling fans because it was "hot as hell" and she went ballistic. Another "infamous" occurrence...back then, I had an infatuation with the letter 'C' (worse than I am with 'Y' today), mostly because there was a kid in my class named Marc with a 'C', and I didn't like that. So I always flashed the letter 'C' with my hand in his face. One day, I did that repeatedly, and the teacher put a checkmark next to my name on the "bad board" every time I did that. By the time I was through, I had twenty two checks next to my name. Four would get you an office referral. Miraculously, not only did I not get a referral, but they somehow all got erased, and I wound up with two checks on the "good board" later on (to then be replaced with a check or two on the bad board again). But that teacher would make an example of me any chance she could.

[capella]

I don't know if you can say if I was "bullied" and "abused" by teachers (students are a different story), but I had many teachers who did not like me...mostly due to my immaturity. A few of them lost their temper at me, and given how behind the curve I was in retrospect, I don't blame them.

The teacher who probably "bullied" me the most was probably my first grade teacher. She really had it in with me...consistently giving me 'N' and 'U' for behavior. One time, I told her that my parents bought ceiling fans because it was "hot as hell" and she went ballistic. Another "infamous" occurrence...back then, I had an infatuation with the letter 'C' (worse than I am with 'Y' today), mostly because there was a kid in my class named Marc with a 'C', and I didn't like that. So I always flashed the letter 'C' with my hand in his face. One day, I did that repeatedly, and the teacher put a checkmark next to my name on the "bad board" every time I did that. By the time I was through, I had twenty two checks next to my name. Four would get you an office referral. Miraculously, not only did I not get a referral, but they somehow all got erased, and I wound up with two checks on the "good board" later on (to then be replaced with a check or two on the bad board again). But that teacher would make an example of me any chance she could.

Hmm, to be honest, I would have an issue with a student antagonizing another student like that as well. There would be consequences for behavior like that.

Shimma's post about the teacher and the lawyer scenario.... why didn't your parents ask to have you transferred? I think that teacher probably did have it in for you. That's awful and I'm so sorry. There is a kid in my school whose dad really screwed me over on landscaping stuff this summer. He's in second grade. If I were going to stay at this school you better believe there's no way I would have that kid in my class. No way.

A lot of times what you remember from school and what actually happened are two different things. I'm not saying all teachers are perfect, but I have met very few who would even THINK of treating a student like that. Most of the time if a student is getting in trouble in school, I would say about 99.9% of the time, the student was doing SOMETHING.

I hate the "you're picking on my child" stance. No, your child was acting out and needed to be corrected. I don't have the friggin' time to pick on a child. I do not have time to sit and plot how I'm going to "get" your little Suzie or Johnny.

[dengeist]

The point of the article to me was "Ask first, don't jump to conclusions."

[shimma]

Shimma's post about the teacher and the lawyer scenario.... why didn't your parents ask to have you transferred? I think that teacher probably did have it in for you. That's awful and I'm so sorry. There is a kid in my school whose dad really screwed me over on landscaping stuff this summer. He's in second grade. If I were going to stay at this school you better believe there's no way I would have that kid in my class. No way.


See, you're that pissed about your freaking lawn. Imagine if it were losing custody of your children, losing ownership of your house and having to move out, and going from being a stay at home mom to being forced back into the workplace, to make not so great pay.

My parents had their own issues, believed I was a bad seed for stupid reasons for very long, wanted me to "fight my own battles", and refused to pay attention to my problem until the following year, when her abuse had gotten so bad and so widespread (and other teachers were following suit) that basically, the administration told my parents they couldn't support my being there any longer.

I had basically just stopped speaking in school by about the middle of fifth grade till I transferred after 6th, pretty much left most people alone except for the two people I'd talk to, and this other girl that glommed onto me. So it wasn't a behavior problem, just how gossip works. In my mind, my parents were just as much, if not more at fault, than my teacher for letting the situation continue for so long.

[capella]

See, you're that pissed about your freaking lawn. Imagine if it were losing custody of your children, losing ownership of your house and having to move out, and going from being a stay at home mom to being forced back into the workplace, to make not so great pay.

My parents had their own issues, believed I was a bad seed for stupid reasons for very long, wanted me to "fight my own battles", and refused to pay attention to my problem until the following year, when her abuse had gotten so bad and so widespread (and other teachers were following suit) that basically, the administration told my parents they couldn't support my being there any longer.

I had basically just stopped speaking in school by about the middle of fifth grade till I transferred after 6th, pretty much left most people alone except for the two people I'd talk to, and this other girl that glommed onto me. So it wasn't a behavior problem, just how gossip works. In my mind, my parents were just as much, if not more at fault, than my teacher for letting the situation continue for so long.
Actually, it's more that the parents would be giving me shit and complaining about me than that I wouldn't treat the kid fairly. I just don't want to be a part of it. I'm not pissed about the yard still. It's done and over with. But I know this parent and I know that he would cause me a lot of grief and trouble. I don't need any part of that.

[yankeeyosh]

Hmm, to be honest, I would have an issue with a student antagonizing another student like that as well. There would be consequences for behavior like that.

Well, I'm not saying I was right. The problem was that the teacher made no attempt to correct me. All she did was continue to punish me.

[shimma]

Actually, it's more that the parents would be giving me shit and complaining about me than that I wouldn't treat the kid fairly. I just don't want to be a part of it. I'm not pissed about the yard still. It's done and over with. But I know this parent and I know that he would cause me a lot of grief and trouble. I don't need any part of that.

Or that. :redface: My bad. Sorry Amy.

[ebruening]

This semester, I have had several parents come meet with me, because their child tells them that I "pick on" them. I used to become really, really worried about it, letting it bother me for days before each meeting. However, now, I'm likely to let the situation blow over without much worry. More often than not, meeting with the parents (and student) has been a positive experience for everyone involved. Most parents I've met with have been pretty understanding about the situation, and we've developed mostly effective plans to help their child succeed in my classroom. In one case, (and this is my opinion), the parent seems to have larger issues at work than just her child's behavior in my classroom.

[capella]

Well, I'm not saying I was right. The problem was that the teacher made no attempt to correct me. All she did was continue to punish me.
Yeah, that's ineffective. But that's more the teacher not knowing how to handle you than it is the teacher purposely being mean and picking on you.

If you had been in my class, I would have spoken to you about being polite and if you continued you would have been moved to a time out. I would have called home as well. I don't do any sort of antagonizing behavior check mark system, colored card pull system, or anything like that.

I am just very strict and direct. I also know strategies to manage behavior like that. There are few kids who I can't get in line. My biggest behavior problem this year is going to a special Star Student breakfast this week for turning his behavior around. And I am having him tested for gifted (because he is!!) and I think that's where a lot of the behavior issues are coming from.

I always look for the reason for the behavior. Nobody does anything without getting something out of it. I just look for what they're getting out of it and try to satisfy that need with an alternative behavior. It's not an easy thing to do because everyone is different and you have to be good at dealing with all kinds of people. Kids are people too..... they're just smaller ones.

And if you had that much trouble with interacting with peers, I would have put you in the guidance group for social skill building. I don't think teachers paid much attention to how important social skills are back in the 1980s.

[capella]

Or that. :redface: My bad. Sorry Amy.
S'OK. :) I know he's mad that I fired his sorry tail. So that would be a bad deal if I had to have his kid in class. It's so much easier to get teachers in "trouble" now than it used to be. I have almost no rights whatsoever. So I would cover my own ass and make sure I didn't have that kind of liability in my classroom. Plus he's been in 3 different second grade classes already this year. Yeah. THREE different classes. MMMHMMM...

[shimma]

It's so much easier to get teachers in "trouble" now than it used to be. I have almost no rights whatsoever. So I would cover my own ass and make sure I didn't have that kind of liability in my classroom. Plus he's been in 3 different second grade classes already this year. Yeah. THREE different classes. MMMHMMM...

No kidding, one of my girl friends who is a preschool teacher says they're not even allowed to help the kids in the bathroom. They're 3 and 4 years old! They can't always wipe properly.

Holy shit, three? It's only December!