Regarding comfortability and cliques

[wordsmith]

I don't really know where I should put this, but this seems as general a place as any.

It's come up a lot lately that newbies don't feel comfortable because of perceived cliquishness, and I thought it would be appropriate to address this. If mods or admin think I'm speaking out of line, feel free to take this down. But I'm really just trying to help.

I'm offering my perspective as probably the regular poster who, registration-wise, dates back the longest in the history of the boards. I think I'm probably the first registered of any regular posters at this point...but I only recently (under a year) became a regular poster. I lurked sporadically initially, not posting for long stretches at a time. In truth, though my post count might be high, I'm in many regards as much of a newbie as anyone, since I only started posting with any regularity this past winter. Some people who consider themselves newbies have probably been active as long or longer as I have.

I don't want to minimize anyone's feelings, but I have to say that I've been a member of a few public boards, and these boards are among the most supportive and welcoming out there, as I think is appropriate, given the population they're intended to serve. I truly don't think anyone's being intentionally cliquey or closed-society. It's just inevitable that as posters spend more time here, they have more to converse about. Really, most everyone's in the same boat...we're all just names on a screen. The only difference is that some have had lots of posts to establish their persona thus far.

Speaking for myself, I'll interact with any poster who strikes some interest within me, regardless if I've seen them posting for a year or if they registered that day. One new poster and I exchanged PMs well before this person every even made post one. It's not a matter of "Oh, newbies! Long-time posters, let's band together and flame them!" I just don't see that happening. I see people getting in intense discussions about things that matter to them, and I see that happening whether posters are brand new or have been here ages. With very, very few exceptions, the only people who get flamed are people who have done something that warrants derision. I personally am thrilled with newbies, the latest run in particular.

I would say that the best way to get over feeling left out is to jump in. The only thing people have to go on when getting familiar with you is your posts. The more often you post, the more of a presence you'll be. And the more of a presence you are, the more you'll feel a part of things.

Just my two cents. But since it's me, it's more like 50 cents, because I can't shut up.

[pisces2473]

I agree with Word. I'll talk to anyone on here. Don't be shy--just jump in and join the fun! If we seem a little cliquey, it's probably because we've had conversations off the boards, but I know most of us love to talk to new people. It's been great to see so many new people in the past few days! :)

[WeirdBrake]

I totally agree with WS. As another longstanding member (since May of '02), I've seen a lot of post/thread/member interaction on here. I've seen posters come and go, I've seen different members go in and out as far as being "active," and I've seen people join and only post stuff every now and then. I second what WS said about it being one of the most supportive online communities out there.

One of the aspects I like so much about this board in particular-- and that I've found to be indescribably valuable-- is the diversity of backgrounds and perspectives. Many people will join and post something, and I'll be able to identify with them instantly because their life issues are so similar to my own that it's scary. Others will join, and I won't be able to identify with them much at all because their lives and problems are so different from mine. And then there will be people on here with whom I can identify in some ways but not others. And sometimes I'll think to myself, "Wow, I never would have thought THIS type of person would have a problem with THAT!"

In any case, this board has always been enormously educational for me as far as learning about other people's lives and about how my peers around the country and world experience things. I've found the boards to be very supportive. The general tendency here seems to be to give sincere praise when possible, to give sympathy and understanding when appropriate, and to give honest help, feedback, criticism, negative predictions, etc. when they can't be avoided and to do so in a nice way.

I haven't experienced "flaming" to be too much of a problem, although, like any ungated online community, there will always inevitably be a few "trolls" every now and then who come here with the obvious purpose of being nasty or provoking fights. In response, such individuals are usually quickly condemned, reported, banned, etc. Like any social community, outright rudeness and nastiness is met with outright rudeness and nastiness. But fortunately, this has largely been the exception in the past 2 and a half years since I joined.

[red]

well, as i said in another thread, i disagree. i guess what bothered me was when i started this thread
http://www.quarterlifecrisis.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4931&perpage=15&pagenumber=1
i mean, i was talking about something that was very serious to me and then everyone started with their jokes. there are lots of fluff threads. i'm not new, and it almost kept me from coming back. but if i had been new, written a serious, heartfelt post, had it deleted, and then when i asked about it, people joked around, i definitely would not have felt welcome.

[wordsmith]

I completely agree, red...I remember when your post was deleted, and felt like it sucked that that happened, and said so. You really laid a lot on the line, and I felt awful when that thread was deleted.

But that's a completely different situation than what I'm talking about. It relates to what I think is a flaw in the structure of the boards, which allows someone who originated a thread to delete the thread as a whole, rather than just their posts. I'm thinking that the poster who deleted the thread didn't do so to remove what was a very heartfelt and impressive message on your behalf, and I don't even think he probably realized that by deleting his original post, it would wipe out the whole thread, or if he did, just didn't think about how that would come across or make you feel. I'm guessing the people who made light of the deletion were not people who had read your post, b/c nobody would have been flip about such a personal thing. I'm sure they didn't realize the seriousness of what had been deleted. That would bother me, too.

But I'm not sure it's the same thing I'm talking about.

[Skyblade]

I agree for the most part to what has been said already. I remember in the beginning I did feel as though there were a lot of inside jokes or that people already knew eachother really well. But thats the way groups are both online and off, you have to get to know eachother and I don't really think that anyone has been hostile towards any newbie, unless they said something particularly offensive right of the bat.

[red]

words, i appreciate your support. i know the situation i mentioned was not exactly what you had in mind, but i thought it was related. i said on page 1 of the post i referenced that:
having read my post, i'm sure you understand why i was upset that it was deleted. anyway, i appreciate you taking the time to post and explain.
the fact that i was a victim of sexual violence has been a big part of my QLC and i am just not going to be ashamed about it anymore. it has been very hard for me to get to this place, and i'm glad we can talk these things on this site.
and then came all the joking around on pages 2 and 3. i assume that the original poster either didn't read my post / didn't understand how serious it was/ didn't realize the whole thread would be deleted. i'm just saying that this is an example of a situation that made me feel unwelcome.

[bigboom]

its not like its really cliquey. its more like everyone just talks to everyone as one big clique so it was easier to break into this board than some others out there. but still at first it was kinda hard to get into, but now im hooked.

i started out as a lurker and didnt really start posting till 1.5 months ago? ever since then everyone on here has been great and id just like to use this thread to thank everyone for that. ive never felt so comfortable in an online community where i have never met anyone face to face. sniff sniff...

[wordsmith]

I totally understand, red. I hope you realize that a lot of people think that took a lot of guts, and would never have minimized or joked about what you posted. My heart sank when it vanished. I've thought about it a lot.

The fluffy posts are fun, but getting the heart of stuff is really where this board means a lot to me, actually.

P.S. bigboom, can it really be that you've only been here that long? You're living proof that jumping in and going post CRAZY can make it seem like you've been here forever.

[coll214]

Believe it or not, i was a longtime lurker before i ever posted a thing. And now i've been here for quite awhile, i'd say 80% of the time that Wordsmith is right, it's very supportive and inviting to everyone. This board has helped me be the overly calm person everyone seems to think i am :).

Though i have noticed at times that people do seem to flame a person for a simple comment; sometimes a message board doesn't get the real point a person was trying to make come across correctly...

As for cliques; sometimes it does seem cliquey, but ehh; i'd say it's still more of a welcome cliqueness as opposed to get out of here you godforsaken newbie. Newbies are always a welcome change :).

[bigboom]

Originally posted by wordsmith
I totally understand, red. I hope you realize that a lot of people think that took a lot of guts, and would never have minimized or joked about what you posted. My heart sank when it vanished. I've thought about it a lot.

The fluffy posts are fun, but getting the heart of stuff is really where this board means a lot to me, actually.

P.S. bigboom, can it really be that you've only been here that long? You're living proof that jumping in and going post CRAZY can make it seem like you've been here forever.

yeah i signed up back in march but never really posted till august...and since then well i kinda went "post crazy" like you said. i find a lot of times other peoples problems help me solve my own problems and thats one of the best things about this board. now...if only the rest of society could act like people here!

[wordsmith]

Speaking of which, has anyone SEEN the number of new posters who have registered since the Boston Globe article came out? It's incredible... something like 4 full pages of people who registered since Sept. 8 or thereabouts. That's over a hundred new members. I knew it was a lot, but I didn't expect that much. Most haven't posted, but lots have. That rules.

[Skyblade]

Its good to know that twenty-somethings are still reading newspapers!
I wish more papers would feature articles about QLC.

[wordsmith]

I'm betting they're more reading it online and having the link fowarded to them than reading an actual paper (I'm aware in my job of exactly how few in that demographic buy/read physical papers), but whatever. I think that magazines and online news sources are the key to getting the info out. I wouldn't write a QLC article in mine, for example, because it doesn't really apply to my main readership. I think even bigger papers find this as well.

Also, there was stuff in the last, not current, issue of Minneapolis' Utne Magazine, which draws a progressive crowd. I know at least one new poster had her interest piqued by that article.

[kitalyn414]

i think the feeling that this board can be cliquey has to do with the fact that some of us sit on our asses in front of the computer all day long with nothing to do, while others don't. if you have more time to post, then you will probably post more & become a "regular."

i have no recollection of someone who jumped in head first and was shut down. that isn't to say that people's initial posts aren't misunderstood. often times new comers don't get the atmosphere of the board, & may come under fire for it. i know some of my initial posts weren't met with all that much welcoming. however, i kept posting & soon felt welcomed and that i was definitely part of the community. it is a good feeling. that's not to say that i still don't feel outside-looking-in once in a while. especially when i turn on my computer and all you east coasters have been posting for 3 hours already!

i think everyone needs to be a little less sensitive. i mean, most of us don't really know eachother either. if one or two of your posts aren't met with open arms, then keep trying. usually we can all find a common ground & it is always fun to add new "regulars."

and welcome to all you newcomers. i hope you all feel comfortable enough to keep posting. you won't be sorry!:D

[pisces2473]

My biggest fear: in whatever job I get next, I won't have as much 'net time as I do right now. :eek:

[wordsmith]

Hmm.

Memo from Boss today to all employees:

"In a request from a higher authority, I have been asked to try to keep overtime hours to a minimum for employees through October, which is the end of our fiscal year. Obviously, don't let it jeopardize your getting your work done, but if you have a meeting or a game to cover, take that afternoon off and go home. Try to maximize the time you are here by getting your work done in a timely manner so as to cut down on the overtime hours. Any questions or concerns, please ask."

Looks like I can't be on as much, either! :( At least, not when I don't have everything done, unlike today, where I'm caught up.

[cheshrcarol]

First of all I want to say welcome to all the new people. Before I started writing this, I saw that there were 17 guests on the boards right now, and I hope that for those of you who aren't registered, you don't feel intimidated about posting.

When I first started coming to this site last winter, I was reluctant to post at first. I would read all the threads and feel like everyone here was already friends. But I've realized after being here for almost a year is that everyone is friendly and welcoming, and even if you're a first time poster no one says, "you only have 1 post, why are you butting in?". The only time people have gotten "flamed" is when they've been mean and rude. No one around here has problems with "tell it like it is" advice, in fact certain members have been embraced for it.

But I can see where people who think this board is cliquey are coming from. I would consider myself a regular, I'm here most days and I post most every day, but I still get the feeling sometimes that everyone around me is better friends with eachother than I am with anyone. Does anyone else ever feel this way? Maybe it's just part of my QLC - feeling alienated ;).

[wordsmith]

Just remember that in truth, there are really only a few of us that have even met other posters in real life...People might seem like personal friends (and I like to think I'm friendly with lots of wonderful posters on here), but in reality, almost everyone's in the same boat. It's just a matter of being an active poster, and noting and remembering things others have posted about.

[pisces2473]

Originally posted by wordsmith
Memo from Boss today to all employees:

"In a request from a higher authority, I have been asked to try to keep overtime hours to a minimum for employees through October, which is the end of our fiscal year. Obviously, don't let it jeopardize your getting your work done, but if you have a meeting or a game to cover, take that afternoon off and go home. Try to maximize the time you are here by getting your work done in a timely manner so as to cut down on the overtime hours. Any questions or concerns, please ask."
So does this mean that if you come in to work in the morning and don't have anything to do after lunch, but need to cover a school board meeting at 7, you have to leave work instead of just hanging around?

Chesh, I count you as one of the people I know on this board--even though we don't interact personally! :)

[wordsmith]

Originally posted by pisces2473

So does this mean that if you come in to work in the morning and don't have anything to do after lunch, but need to cover a school board meeting at 7, you have to leave work instead of just hanging around?

Apparently. Which is fine for me, as I live a block away, but I have a coworker who lives 24 miles, round trip, away...she's supposed to make that drive up in the a.m., work till midday, go home, and make the drive up and back again for the meeting? WTF?

And the dumbass (boss) fails to recognize that with the amount of afterhours coverage dumped on me for evenings and weekends (for BOTH papers, one of which I staff ALONE) I could NEVER have an office hour and still have a full workweek. But just not coming in wouldn't fly. Blah.

Sometimes I don't know how he thinks work gets done around here.

OH, and did I mention that we DON'T EVEN GET OVERTIME??? We just make straight time for additional hour worked.

Okay...we now return to the regularly scheduled thread. This message was brought to you by a disgruntled wordsmith.

[Crimson King II]

I don't perceive this as a problem. While I'd also like to welcome everyone new, I think they need to realize that many of us have been talking about many different subjects and topics for months, even years. They came here because of recent media coverage and whatnot, and that's fine, but I won't be abridging or altering my communication style simply because there's an influx of new people. They can discuss anything with me...and others will tell them we're all pretty reasonable. But the forums have a certain personality and a certain integrity that should not change because of a few perceptions made over a couple of weeks. The best way to break the cliquishness? Jump in and discuss with everyone here! I welcome each of you to do so, and look forward to you doing so, and each of us making new friends with you along the way.

So welcome!

And watch out for Weirdbrake. He's a lawyer...and lawyers suck. A lot. They're evil....because they're lawyers. But never mind him too much...he's still ok. Just realize the warped perspective from where he is coming!

CK

[MetFanL]

But I can see where people who think this board is cliquey are coming from. I would consider myself a regular, I'm here most days and I post most every day, but I still get the feeling sometimes that everyone around me is better friends with eachother than I am with anyone. Does anyone else ever feel this way? Maybe it's just part of my QLC - feeling alienated .

nah, it's not just you... I don't even remember when I started actually posting her, but I get that same feeling sometimes.

Oh well... not like I make much of an effort, either. ;)

[pisces2473]

Originally posted by wordsmith
OH, and did I mention that we DON'T EVEN GET OVERTIME??? We just make straight time for additional hour worked.
I think he was just calling that overtime...yeah, I don't think they want to pay you for any more than they have to. SUCKS.

[wordsmith]

I don't think anyone's suggesting that anything be changed, CK.

What I posted was more in defense of what I think is a decently functioning community, and to reassure posters that it's nothing to be wary of jumping into, or feeling excluded from. I agree in that I don't think that anything needs to be altered.

[pisces2473]

I'd like to make an announcement:


CK IS A LAWYER


Thank you.

[wordsmith]

Originally posted by pisces2473

I think he was just calling that overtime...yeah, I don't think they want to pay you for any more than they have to. SUCKS.

Yeah, Jen...but I object that it's phrased like we're costing him (or the co.) loads in overtime pay. We should be so lucky.

What I really object to is that if they actually would HIRE a sufficient number of staffers to do the work, we wouldn't work so many hours. But then they'd have to come up with far more money for salaries and benefits for those people. As it is, they're getting a steal of a deal. Excuse us for having to work a lot to get the work we need an additional 3 staffers for done. Fuckers.

Didn't I say I wasn't gonna rant anymore? :redface:

[pisces2473]

Originally posted by wordsmith
What I really object to is that if they actually would HIRE a sufficient number of staffers to do the work, we wouldn't work so many hours. But then they'd have to come up with far more money for salaries and benefits for those people. As it is, they're getting a steal of a deal. Excuse us for having to work a lot to get the work we need an additional 3 staffers for done. Fuckers.
And you get into trouble if you don't do the work of those 3 people right?

[wordsmith]

To some extent, yes, but worse than that is that if you don't do it, you're left with nothing to put in the paper. Blah.

[pisces2473]

LOL yeah, that's what I was getting at. It's like, either put up and shut up or you'll have a shitty paper.

What gives?

[red]

But I can see where people who think this board is cliquey are coming from. I would consider myself a regular, I'm here most days and I post most every day, but I still get the feeling sometimes that everyone around me is better friends with eachother than I am with anyone. Does anyone else ever feel this way? Maybe it's just part of my QLC - feeling alienated .

i think that while newbies should try not to be so sensitive, that regulars should try to be a little more sensitive. i've been here a long time, but i don't consider myself to be a regular. i don't post that much anymore. but i think some things are sensitive and not funny! and being raped is one of them. maybe i'm off base, but i felt that a regular would have been treated with more sensitivity. or at least i hope they would.
anyway wordsmith, thank you for your kind words. that meant a lot to me.

[cheshrcarol]

Pisces - thanks :)

Red - I know you were hurt by the way people were talking on your thread, but I really don't think it would have made a difference whether you were someone who posts here all day long, or if you were brand new. It's just the nature of message boards that even in one subject thread there are multiple conversations happening. Look at this one right now, for example. Some people are talking about cliques, Wordsmith and Pisces are talking about Wordsmith's OT, Pisces is making sure we all know Crimson's a lawyer (LOL), it's just the way we all interact. I'm sure no one was trying to undermine the seriousness of the subject matter by joking about something else.

[wordsmith]

Red, I really have a feeling that a lot of people who wrote something flip later on DID NOT read your post before it was deleted, and had no idea. I can't imagine anyone, even the biggest asshole, knowingly making light of that.

[wordsmith]

And I also agree that some regs should be a little more sensitive. Not for the sake of the newbies, per se, just for its own sake.

[red]

words, i totally agree that they probably didn't read my post before it was deleted, but it's right there on page 1 of the thread. not in such great detail, but still there.
i guess that personally, i don't joke around when someone posts a thread like illness, death, etc. i just think some things warrant a little more sensitivity.

[wordsmith]

Agreed. They might have skimmed it, though. Not everyone reads every post. Effing twentysomething slackers!

[WeirdBrake]

Awwww, eph. Red and everyone else already forgave you on that other thread, didn't ya see?

Somebody needs a hug!

[WeirdBrake]

((((ephphatha)))))

[and1grad]

On an unrelated note...didnt Chris Rock say Martin Luther King was the capital of Zaire?

I think of this place as being like a freeway onramp. Its up to you to merge and not everybody's gonna like how u drive but we're all just trying to find our way.

[WeirdBrake]

On an unrelated note...didnt Chris Rock say Martin Luther King was the capital of Zaire?

But can you tell us the name of the woman who would not leave her seat on the bus?

I think of this place as being like a freeway onramp. Its up to you to merge and not everybody's gonna like how u drive but we're all just trying to find our way.

*California voice* Whoa, dude!... That's, like, so deep!

[heatherf]

Thank you And1 for starting another Chris Rock thread....

[and1grad]

My bad, h-town...i took the bait.

*Joisey voice* Do you'se got a problem with me, WB?

p.s. shouldnt u be at home watchin reruns of "Who's the Boss" or something?

[WeirdBrake]

Oh, I get it! MARTINA LUTHER KING!

[wordsmith]

AAAANGela!!!

[and1grad]

lol

sorry if i killed this thread. WB made me do it.

[SweetEm]

Yay I'm progressive!