Loyalty towards corporate america - is it possible?

crystal_dance · #1 10-16-2006, 01:56 AM

It's funny how corporations try to teach ethics and loyalty to students on campuses these days. Corporations spend millions on Sarbanes Oxley compliance which is not only a pain in the ass but something that was unecessarily brought about just because of a dishonest little company called Enron.

They tell us that they look for candidates who can show commitment to community. People who can be honest, hard working citizens of the world. They say they seek self thinkers. People who can stand out. People who will stick by a company through thick and thin. They look for all american heroes...

Reality is so different though. Corporations are greedy and selfish. They don't give a rats ass about community and you are an expendable commodity that can be renewed. They don't seek out of the box thinkers. They seek cogs. They want people who they can mold and program into doing a task over and over again. It's ridiculous. They try to con you of your true worth offering you low salaries. Senior management get where they are through anything but merit. Stock options are backdated, businesses are re-engineered, pension funds are wiped out, veteran employees are sacked and in the process a few men get richer.

I'm not exactly ranting here, but painting a picture of reality. It's true, all this happens. So why do companies say they seek the highest quality people who are honest and ethical when the top execs are con artists ?

yankeeyosh · #2 10-16-2006, 08:31 AM

Amen Brothah!!!!! AMEN!!!!!!!!!!

Corporate (or shall I say CRAPorate) America is simply greed, being cutthroat, and not really caring about what makes America REALLY work...the individual.

Here's an example...when the plane crashed killing Yankee Cory Lidle last week, the people in my office were more concerned about what this meant for the bottom line than any possible human toll and whether this was terrorism (this was before all the details were in). My boss was even laughing at the matter. This is why I despise Corporate America. They don't have any interest other than a few fat cats in some penthouse New York office who you will never meet. Same goes with the employees. Sure, they'll throw you a bone once in a while, but it means shit. At the end of the day, they're not going to care about you or your wellbeing. So you worked 80 hours a week and are manager at 24? Good. Now continue working 80-90 hours a week until you reach the next rung of management. And the next rung, etc. That's all it is. And it's not worth it.

Oh yeah, and if there's one thing they don't like about you...whether it's the color of your shirt or the shape of your head, you're out the door...and you have to scramble and compete with millions of other bright-eyed naive soon-to-be-victims to find yet ANOTHER miserable boring low-level position in the rat race called CRAPorate America.

The X · #3 10-16-2006, 10:17 AM

Work for the government. Less money, but less bullshit.

cache · #4 10-16-2006, 10:24 AM

OK. I'll play ball.

Sure, there are those elites in corporate america who get richer, and often times, management ignores responsibility in the name of profit. But, when you talk about Enron, it is the exception. Throw in World Com, Tyco, Global Crossing, and a dozen other crooked companies/executives. Heck, throw in a few hundred. You hear about them because they are the exception. Most corporations act ethically and responsibly. If you think people as individuals are any different, you are sorely mistaken. Let's take about the number of people who cheat on their significant others. Or the number of people who abuse their children. Or the number of people who cheat on their taxes. Or who know that the grocery clerk gave them too much change but say nothing.

I happen to be of the opinion that corporate america, while it has its issues, has helped keep this economy moving forward for the last half century at a rate unseen almost ever in history. Corporations DO reward merit, but you must be deserving to receive those rewards. A college education is not a ticket to anything, despite what you may have been told. If you choose corporate america, then you must be willing to run at its pace, and not for one second think that it is YOU who dictates the pace. If you do't like the race, get out of the game.

Me? I love the race. I want to move into executive management one day, and I do so by consistantly doing a few things: playing by the rules of corporate america, and infusing my work with my own ideas and innovations while still staying in the accepted framework. At the same time, I maintain my own identity, and always question the ethics of my work and the company I work for. I will not contribute to the unethical side of business when I am consciously aware of it. That is why I can stand here and defend that which you despise.

allie1105 · #5 10-16-2006, 12:09 PM

I hate, hate, hate corporate america. I can't wait to get the hell out...it doesn't matter how many hours you put in or how well you perform - if the company goes to shit, then you get canned. I almost lost my job b/c they were doing away with one of the products we sell.

I hate the people - so concerned with a company that has no concern for them. People put their lives and their families on hold all the time, but for what? Why should I give my soul to a corporation who cares more about the bottom line rather than the individual? Ethical behavior? I'm supposed to display this, when corporate america has no IDEA what this means?

LaFille · #6 10-16-2006, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by allie1105

I hate, hate, hate corporate america. I can't wait to get the hell out...it doesn't matter how many hours you put in or how well you perform - if the company goes to shit, then you get canned. I almost lost my job b/c they were doing away with one of the products we sell.

I hate the people - so concerned with a company that has no concern for them. People put their lives and their families on hold all the time, but for what? Why should I give my soul to a corporation who cares more about the bottom line rather than the individual? Ethical behavior? I'm supposed to display this, when corporate america has no IDEA what this means?

i don't feel like it's for me either. i think this is one contributing problem to me finding a job. i don't want to join the rat race. i don't want to be just another pawn for some big company that doesn't give a shit about me or the community or anything.

i went to a job interview and the guy was like 'so, why do you think you belong in corporate america?' and i seriously felt like saying 'oops, i just realized that i don't!' of course i gave some canned answer, but later i was like holy crap, i'm sitting here in the middle of a job search and i forgot to ask myself question #1: do i belong in corporate america?!?!

cache · #7 10-16-2006, 02:49 PM

...

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Seems like its pretty lonely on my side of the room

LaFille · #8 10-16-2006, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cache

...

...

Seems like its pretty lonely on my side of the room

honestly though, we need people who do enjoy the corporate scene and who are good at making it work to make this country and our economy run. i admire and am grateful for people who can do it.

it's better for myself and for the entire universe if i stay out of the corporate scene though

BlueEyedFunOne · #9 10-16-2006, 03:23 PM

I work in the corporate environment, although I'm not a big fan of it. The way I see it, I'm working to make someone else rich.

WorkInProgress · #10 10-16-2006, 03:38 PM

I work for a company (medium-ish size), and I don't feel this sort of anger or bitterness towards corporate America. But I also haven't worked in a shitty work environment, either.

I'm not sure that loyalty towards "corporate america" as an entity is even possible--and I'm not sure what that supposed to mean, in all honesty.

I am, however, quite loyal to my company. I think the muckety-mucks have worked very hard (and continue to do so) to cultivate this. Partly because it makes happier employees, and partly because they (for ex. my company president, and the founder) are genuinely wonderful people. Perhaps my employer is the exception, but I've never had any reason to gripe, and I've never felt used. Even though replacing me wouldn't really be all that difficult, and would probably be cheaper. Not saying that there aren't issues, or that every day is just peachy, but overall, it's good.

I'm working for me. And "the big boss" is probably one of the most hardworking people I have ever seen. I know that he earns whatever it is that he gets, which I'm hoping is a lot.

crystal_dance · #11 10-16-2006, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cache

OK. I'll play ball.

Sure, there are those elites in corporate america who get richer, and often times, management ignores responsibility in the name of profit. But, when you talk about Enron, it is the exception. Throw in World Com, Tyco, Global Crossing, and a dozen other crooked companies/executives. Heck, throw in a few hundred. You hear about them because they are the exception. Most corporations act ethically and responsibly. If you think people as individuals are any different, you are sorely mistaken. Let's take about the number of people who cheat on their significant others. Or the number of people who abuse their children. Or the number of people who cheat on their taxes. Or who know that the grocery clerk gave them too much change but say nothing.

I happen to be of the opinion that corporate america, while it has its issues, has helped keep this economy moving forward for the last half century at a rate unseen almost ever in history. Corporations DO reward merit, but you must be deserving to receive those rewards. A college education is not a ticket to anything, despite what you may have been told. If you choose corporate america, then you must be willing to run at its pace, and not for one second think that it is YOU who dictates the pace. If you do't like the race, get out of the game.

Me? I love the race. I want to move into executive management one day, and I do so by consistantly doing a few things: playing by the rules of corporate america, and infusing my work with my own ideas and innovations while still staying in the accepted framework. At the same time, I maintain my own identity, and always question the ethics of my work and the company I work for. I will not contribute to the unethical side of business when I am consciously aware of it. That is why I can stand here and defend that which you despise.

It's wonderful that you stand here defending corporate america's cause and all that, but I wasn't ranting and raving at the injustice of it all. I am fully aware of the flaws and successes of America Inc. and know better than to expect the world to revolve around me.

My question was why do companies pretend to care about communities, people and all that fuzzy good stuff when all of us know that a company's goal is to do what it takes to maximize its ROI.

Let me give you an example of what I meant by this post. My cousin works for a major asset management firm's trading desk in Tokyo. He just graduated and was sent to London for training immediately. When he was recruited he was told that he will be sent to the Hong Kong desk which is what he wanted.
However, midway during training in London they decided to send him to Tokyo instead. It didn't seem so bad at the time because he didn't mind either. However, the company screwed him over by not adjusting his salary to match Tokyo's cost of living. He's being paid the salary he was signed on for HKG which is 75% as expensive as NYC as compared to Tokyo which is 125%. At that rate, you barely break even. Whats the point of going all the way to Tokyo to barely break even?
The sad part is that he declined all the other job offers and interviews after he got this job offer because of loyalty and ethics. But now, whats the point of being a loyal employee when your company leaves you stranded in a foreign land? Get what I'm trying to say?

BlueEyedFunOne · #12 10-16-2006, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WorkInProgress

I'm working for me. And "the big boss" is probably one of the most hardworking people I have ever seen. I know that he earns whatever it is that he gets, which I'm hoping is a lot.

That's awesome. It's nice to hear about some 'big bosses' whose days don't revolve around power-lunches and tee times

WorkInProgress · #13 10-16-2006, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueEyedFunOne

That's awesome. It's nice to hear about some 'big bosses' whose days don't revolve around power-lunches and tee times

Yep, he's good people. One of the things I like best about working here, actually.

WorkInProgress · #14 10-16-2006, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystal_dance

Let me give you an example of what I meant by this post. My cousin works for a major asset management firm's trading desk in Tokyo. He just graduated and was sent to London for training immediately. When he was recruited he was told that he will be sent to the Hong Kong desk which is what he wanted.
However, midway during training in London they decided to send him to Tokyo instead. It didn't seem so bad at the time because he didn't mind either. However, the company screwed him over by not adjusting his salary to match Tokyo's cost of living. He's being paid the salary he was signed on for HKG which is 75% as expensive as NYC as compared to Tokyo which is 125%. At that rate, you barely break even. Whats the point of going all the way to Tokyo to barely break even?
The sad part is that he declined all the other job offers and interviews after he got this job offer because of loyalty and ethics. But now, whats the point of being a loyal employee when your company leaves you stranded in a foreign land? Get what I'm trying to say?

That is such crap. (Not the decision to move him, the decision to not adjust for COL.)

cache · #15 10-16-2006, 04:25 PM

You see, I am a believer that everyone makes their own deals and is responsible for themselves. The corporate environment is one in which you can not be a passive entity and survive. It requires the ability to stand up and speak for yourself. Personally, I have negotiated with my employer for a variety of different things, and am happy with what I get...because it is the way that I want it.

If I was told I had to take a job elsewhere where the COL was much higher with no increase in pay, I would speak up and stand my ground. I am more valuable to them than they are to me. Period. The minute someone stops believing that, is the minute they open themselves up to be taken advantage of now and forever.

Corporations are obligated by law to put profits above all else. The Supreme Court says so. I happen to think corporations do a lot of good for communities, but that is all about perspective. But let me put this to you...what do you do in your local community to make it a better place? Most corporations donate plenty of money, volunteer their employees time, and support non-profits. Do you do all of those things? If you do you are the exception. So why does a corporation have a greater obligation to the community than you do?